BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read
BMW Z4 Forums (G29) BMW Z4 (G29) General Forum First G29 Z4 Roadster Prototype Spied, Returns to the Soft-Top!

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      07-19-2017, 11:29 AM   #573
supra93
Colonel
2474
Rep
2,334
Posts

Drives: Z4, E500, Supra, RX7
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: TX

iTrader: (0)

Is it just me or does the prototype look larger than the outgoing model. Like F-Type size.



Last edited by supra93; 07-19-2017 at 11:46 AM..
Appreciate 0
      07-19-2017, 11:29 AM   #574
Huz-Z
Brigadier General
Huz-Z's Avatar
Canada
843
Rep
4,051
Posts

Drives: Z4 3.0si, 328 XDrive, X5 35i
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Canada

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by jts1981 View Post
Just want to touch base on a few points. The e85 still had the hydraulic steering which is awesome. I love driving my friends e85, and I am jealous of the steering feel. On my e89 Z4 I did improve steering feel and response with m3 upper/ lower control arms, better bushings, and an very god strut bar. But you're right the electric steering is built in a way that it will never match the feel of hydraulic.

For n54, the hpfp was only an issue in early years. I think from 2011 on it was improved. I know for certain 13'/'14 model years had zero issue.

btw I love that Top Gear review for the e85. I also liked the e89 one from Top Gear. Its unfortunate though Fifth Gear compared the regular 35i to a Boxster S, which is a higher trim level. I think the 35is vs Boxter S would have been a better comparison, but why cry over spilt milk.

The Z3 was grossly underpowered and did not have enough kit. I do agree that my e89 is bloated in comparison, but I do like all the creature comforts and the n54 is an amazing engine that is very easy to mod for 400+ whp, 4xx+ tq. As you can see by my signature I'm also heavily modded.
Yes, the later E89 cars certainly had the HPFP issue sorted nicely. To be honest, I quite like a nicely equipped E89; its a great looking car that is very well equipped for legal street / non-track use, just as Jeremy Clarkson of Top Gear suggested. And how many of us buy a car like this for exclusive track use anyway?

Re your friend's e85, would it be a 2006 - 2008 Z4M I wonder? That variant of the E85 had hydraulic steering, while all the non-M cars, like mine, have an electric steering rack.

Oh - and I really like your car - and the color!!

Cheers!
__________________
Huz-Z


BMW Z4 3.0si Roadster. Montego Blue Metallic. Premium and Sport Package.
Appreciate 1
jts1981209.50
      07-19-2017, 11:35 AM   #575
mkoesel
Moderator
United_States
7506
Rep
19,370
Posts

Drives: No BMW for now
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Canton, MI

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by supra93 View Post
I know some people were speculating two 6 cyl trims because of the two different types of larger wheels that were spied.
But those are Supra pics, no?

Even if they are testing two types of 19"/20" wheels for the Z4, that doesn't mean two separate models. BMW often offers an optional upsized wheel for M Performance models.
Appreciate 0
      07-19-2017, 11:36 AM   #576
M3 Adjuster
Banned
Albania
7905
Rep
11,785
Posts

Drives: 1M, X1 M Sport, E46 325ic
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Dallas, Tx

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by jts1981 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by M3 Adjuster View Post
Because new school BMW fans think the six is the only motor BMW should ever use. They have made outstanding 3,4,6,8,10 and 12 pot motors across the years but 80% of bimwads want a 6. Of course now turbo 4 cyl motors are replacing 6 cylinder motors around the world - even Porsche has made the step down.

BMW hasn't even gotten seriously into the 4 cyl game right now again .. when they should be developing a kick arse twin turbo 4 cylinder S motor like an S20 or S48.

So yes... they are clinging to the 6 cylinder as a differentiator. The M2 is a 6 cyl and competes with the 5 cylinder Audi and a 4 cylinder turbo boxster/Cayman and a 4 cylinder Mercedes AMG sedan.
Who knows now. It seams like BMW would probably go hybrid/ awd for daily driver vehicles, and high output turbo 6,8,12 for the M models.

I respect your opinion. To each their own.

On a side note its good knowing these changes only help to increase the value of previous gen, so a 4 cylinder turbo, or hybrid, etc will only make the n54 equipped models more desirable.
Exactly ! BMW over the last decade and more has nearly abandoned the 4 cyl motor in favor of multiple 6 cyl variants. BMW has had the edge with the 3 series vs the A series which have been 4 cyl turbo forever.

Indeed BMW has thrown their attention just as you indicate to the 6 and 8 motors in particular and to hybrid drive.

returning to the z4.. what's needed is a lightweight fun roadster, not a posh heavyweight 6 cylinder car with a metal roof , a very heavy automatic gearbox like a Mercedes Slc.


Boxster
Miata
S2000
Triumph TR
Etc

Just like the Original Z3 but with better handling and a better power plant.

BMWs in general add weight and also lose aerodynamic CD as they convert to M models as it is... if BMW wants to support this new Z4 it need to be light and fun to drive first. Then add more power across the range.

Either way .. this car doesn't even look like it's trying to be anything close to a Z3 or Z4

BMW would have to have call any such replacement a Z2 now.
Appreciate 0
      07-19-2017, 11:45 AM   #577
supra93
Colonel
2474
Rep
2,334
Posts

Drives: Z4, E500, Supra, RX7
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: TX

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by mkoesel View Post
But those are Supra pics, no?

Even if they are testing two types of 19"/20" wheels for the Z4, that doesn't mean two separate models. BMW often offers an optional upsized wheel for M Performance models.
Correct, but I believe the Z has been spied with the same set of wheels.

I see. Another question, so with one I6 offered do y'all think the new Z will be like the current Z4 were we have a 35i and a higher grader 35is with a little extra power?

Last edited by supra93; 07-19-2017 at 11:55 AM..
Appreciate 0
      07-19-2017, 12:10 PM   #578
mkoesel
Moderator
United_States
7506
Rep
19,370
Posts

Drives: No BMW for now
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Canton, MI

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by supra93 View Post
I see. Another question, so with one I6 offered do y'all think the new Z will be like the current Z4 were we have a 35i and a higher grader 35is with a little extra power?
No, that's what I mean when I say there will only be the M Performance model. They don't do "is" models anymore - that has been superseded by the M Performance brand. So what I was getting at with my last post is, just as we've seen with the new X3 (and expect to see with the upcoming new generation X4, 3 Series, and 4 Series), there will be the four cylinder 30i, the six cylinder M40i, and that's it (for gasoline models in the North American market, I mean).

I should add that I am sure they'll offer the "M PPK" ECU upgrade, but that is dealer/port installed aftermarket item, not a factory option.
Appreciate 2
supra932474.00
JustChris17423.00
      07-19-2017, 12:20 PM   #579
bunker
BVARIAN
bunker's Avatar
United_States
642
Rep
570
Posts

Drives: 2022 M240xi
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Cincinnati, OH

iTrader: (0)

OMG I am fully erect ATM
__________________
1999 330ci / 2003 330i / 2008 328i coupe / 2011 328i Touring M-Sport / 2016 M235xi / 2019 440xi GC unicorn / current: 2022 M240xi (the "Purple Porsche Eater")
Appreciate 0
      07-19-2017, 12:25 PM   #580
supra93
Colonel
2474
Rep
2,334
Posts

Drives: Z4, E500, Supra, RX7
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: TX

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by mkoesel View Post
No, that's what I mean when I say there will only be the M Performance model. They don't do "is" models anymore - that has been superseded by the M Performance brand. So what I was getting at with my last post is, just as we've seen with the new X3 (and expect to see with the upcoming new generation X4, 3 Series, and 4 Series), there will be the four cylinder 30i, the six cylinder M40i, and that's it (for gasoline models in the North American market, I mean).

I should add that I am sure they'll offer the "M PPK" ECU upgrade, but that is dealer/port installed aftermarket item, not a factory option.
Oh ok, thanks for the explanation
Appreciate 0
      07-19-2017, 12:31 PM   #581
tranquility
sportscars only
tranquility's Avatar
Canada
3196
Rep
3,190
Posts

Drives: 2011 Z4 sDrive 35i
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Montréal

iTrader: (0)

My 2cs, they should've hired me as a consultant lol. I have an e89 but the e86 as sexy as F, esp the M. I really couldn't care less if it was a convertible or not, but if it must, hardtop pls w/ minimum wt added as much as possible. However, coupe is the way to go if ppl are srs about performance as the primary factor for a sportscar. I would've just modernized the interior of the e86 and a bit of the outside cuz they are dated, included the e89 creature comforts and the N54 and no no no! to RFTs. I loved the small size of the e86. I definitely don't like the direction BMW is going w/ things getting bigger and heavier. I don't have high hopes for this latest version as the ragtop already is a major turnoff.
Appreciate 0
      07-19-2017, 12:41 PM   #582
NickyC
Lieutenant General
NickyC's Avatar
17334
Rep
10,596
Posts

Drives: M4 CS. Former G82, x2 F82, F80
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Jacked out of my mind

iTrader: (23)

If BMW just made more brand new Z4M Roadsters (06-08) and changed nothing, I'd march down to the dealer and buy another one today.
Appreciate 1
scrammer420.50
      07-19-2017, 02:19 PM   #583
DJKapeesh
Lieutenant
DJKapeesh's Avatar
311
Rep
469
Posts

Drives: 11' 135i, 13' 911 C2S, 10' X5D
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Atlanta

iTrader: (1)

Those headlights make it look a lot like an S2000
Appreciate 0
      07-19-2017, 02:37 PM   #584
lemetier
Plenipotentiary
lemetier's Avatar
2614
Rep
3,046
Posts

Drives: Yes
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Location

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by supra93 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by mkoesel View Post
But those are Supra pics, no?

Even if they are testing two types of 19"/20" wheels for the Z4, that doesn't mean two separate models. BMW often offers an optional upsized wheel for M Performance models.
Correct, but I believe the Z has been spied with the same set of wheels.

I see. Another question, so with one I6 offered do y'all think the new Z will be like the current Z4 were we have a 35i and a higher grader 35is with a little extra power?
Any full ///M/TRD/F really only make sense if the BMW is a Coupe and the Toyota/Lexus a roadster.
Attached Images
 
Appreciate 1
JustChris17423.00
      07-19-2017, 05:12 PM   #585
SCOTT26
Major General
SCOTT26's Avatar
5305
Rep
5,824
Posts

Drives: A big F-off German Truck.
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: WORLDWIDE

iTrader: (0)

It has the new Octangular kidney grille which will be seen on the new 8er.
Attached Images
 
__________________
The M850i is evidence that BMW have got their mojo back when it comes to dynamic sports cars...
Appreciate 1
JustChris17423.00
      07-19-2017, 05:18 PM   #586
SCOTT26
Major General
SCOTT26's Avatar
5305
Rep
5,824
Posts

Drives: A big F-off German Truck.
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: WORLDWIDE

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by mkoesel View Post
No. More than likely it means that the M Performance (M40i) model will be the only six cylinder model. This is true for the G2x/G0x 3/4/X3/X4 lineup, so it makes sense that it will hold true for the G29 Z4 as well. Unfortunately, while the others will all get a full blown M model sitting above the M40i powered by a 450hp+ S58, there are currently no plans for a Z4 M (according to SCOTT). But you never know, that could change.
The Roadster market is shrinking considerably so had BMW not jointly developed the car with Toyota then it would probably not have been given the green light especially with the market performance of the previous E89 model.
Should the Z4 revitalise the market especially for BMW?
Then we will see additional progress to capitalise on its success.
But again it is more of a case of "if" rather than when.
__________________
The M850i is evidence that BMW have got their mojo back when it comes to dynamic sports cars...
Appreciate 1
mkoesel7505.50
      07-20-2017, 07:33 AM   #587
mkoesel
Moderator
United_States
7506
Rep
19,370
Posts

Drives: No BMW for now
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Canton, MI

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by lemetier View Post
Any full ///M/TRD/F really only make sense if the BMW is a Coupe and the Toyota/Lexus a roadster.
Not really since drop top M vehicles are very popular. The last M roadster sold well in its day for what it was (a low volume vehicle to begin with) - more so than the coupe, in fact. Today, we have the M4 convertible which also sells well. Furthermore, currently there is no M6 (and 6 series) coupe being sold in the US at all - just the convertible and gran coupe. And, finally, there is an M8 convertible in the works too.

Just to keep this on topic, in case people are waiting to pounce, I'd prefer if we don't turn this thread into a debate about how, despite being marketable vehicles, convertibles don't truly deserve the M label because they are too heavy/slow/girly/whatever.
Appreciate 1
scrammer420.50
      07-20-2017, 10:22 AM   #588
The HACK
Midlife Crises Racing Silent but Deadly Class
The HACK's Avatar
1817
Rep
5,337
Posts

Drives: 2006 MZ4C, 2021 Tesla Model 3
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Welcome to Jamaica have a nice day

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by mkoesel View Post
Not really since drop top M vehicles are very popular. The last M roadster sold well in its day for what it was (a low volume vehicle to begin with) - more so than the coupe, in fact.
You sure about that? Both the MZ4 Coupe and MZ4 Roadster sold POORLY. BMW at one point had to put a $10,000 trunk cash incentive to move both. I recall back in 2007 (just 1 year after the MZ4s went into production) there were at least a dozen MZ4s lining up in the back parking lot at the dealership that I bought my car from.

This is from Wikipedia:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMW_M_...2.80.932008.29

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mighty Wikipedia
Production Figures[1]
Coupes: Worldwide: 4,275; North America: 1,815.
Roadsters: Worldwide: 5,070; North America: 3,042
Worldwide production numbers only differ by about 800 units, fully accounting for the fact that the Roadsters went into production in August of 2005 as a MY 2006 model, while Coupe production didn't start until end of March time-frame. It may have sold more by 1,2xx in North America, but that probably reflected BMW's global sales strategy and allocation more than actual "popularity."
__________________
Sitting on a beat-up office chair in front of a 5 year old computer in a basement floor, sipping on stale coffee watching a bunch of meaningless numbers scrolling aimlessly on a dimly lit 19” monitor.
Appreciate 0
      07-20-2017, 10:38 AM   #589
mkoesel
Moderator
United_States
7506
Rep
19,370
Posts

Drives: No BMW for now
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Canton, MI

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by The HACK View Post
You sure about that? Both the MZ4 Coupe and MZ4 Roadster sold POORLY.
I suppose its a matter of perspective. Like I say, it was conceived as a low volume vehicle to begin with. On the other hand, sure, there is a reason why there was no E89 M and no G29-based M is currently planned either.

In any case, let's not forget that I was responding to this point:

Quote:
Originally Posted by lemetier View Post
Any full ///M... really only make sense if the BMW is a Coupe...
As the numbers from the wikipedia page you linked to show, the roadster outsold the coupe in both the US and ROW. You point out that the coupe was not on the market as long. Ok, fair enough, but in any case, roadster sales made up a significant portion of the total volume. And since the two models shared many parts, without those sales, the situation goes from less than ideal to disastrous. So if we are saying that there is no business case for an M roadster, then a coupe-only effort would make even less sense.

I think the real problem lies here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMW_Z4_(E85)#Production

Quote:
Over the Z4's life cycle, 197,950 vehicles had been produced, with 180,856 roadsters and 17,094 coupés.

...

Even from its introduction in 2006, the Coupé was relatively rare: In its first 13 months on the market, the roadster outsold it at a ratio of 7 to 1.
Very telling. Once you take the performance of the M model out of the equation, coupe sales become a tiny fraction of roadster sales. So, its hard to justify the coupe to begin with. And, if there is no series coupe, obviously there can't be an M coupe either.
Appreciate 0
      07-20-2017, 10:41 AM   #590
wdb
dances with roads
wdb's Avatar
4673
Rep
4,090
Posts

Drives: '07 E86, '02 996, '95 Seven
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: the perimeter

iTrader: (4)

The first Z4 coupe I looked at was still owned by the original owner. He said it had sat on the dealer's lot for a year and they gave him a lot of incentives to buy it.
Appreciate 0
      07-20-2017, 11:06 AM   #591
supra93
Colonel
2474
Rep
2,334
Posts

Drives: Z4, E500, Supra, RX7
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: TX

iTrader: (0)

My question is will the Toyota version use their own engine?
Appreciate 0
      07-20-2017, 11:30 AM   #592
Huz-Z
Brigadier General
Huz-Z's Avatar
Canada
843
Rep
4,051
Posts

Drives: Z4 3.0si, 328 XDrive, X5 35i
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Canada

iTrader: (0)

I'm just keen to see what the thing is going to look like with the camo removed. Isn't the big reveal supposed to happen next month?
__________________
Huz-Z


BMW Z4 3.0si Roadster. Montego Blue Metallic. Premium and Sport Package.
Appreciate 0
      07-20-2017, 11:52 AM   #593
supra93
Colonel
2474
Rep
2,334
Posts

Drives: Z4, E500, Supra, RX7
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: TX

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Huz-Z View Post
I'm just keen to see what the thing is going to look like with the camo removed. Isn't the big reveal supposed to happen next month?
I believe it is suppose to be a near production concept.
Appreciate 0
      07-20-2017, 11:54 AM   #594
scrammer
Captain
scrammer's Avatar
Canada
421
Rep
735
Posts

Drives: 2017 M3 Ultimate
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: BC - Canada

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by NickyC View Post
If BMW just made more brand new Z4M Roadsters (06-08) and changed nothing, I'd march down to the dealer and buy another one today.
I am in the same boat!

I have a 2015 BMW X4 xDrive35i M Sport with all the options and tech you could ever want. It's comfortable, easy to drive and has great performance for an SUV. That being said I also have a 2007 Z4M roadster that has very little technology, not much luxury, and few creature comforts ... but it is what I consider a true ///M car.
For me M is about motorsports and performance not about luxury, phone connectivity and GPS. If BMW makes a new M version of the Zed please remember we don't need all that crap, we just want performance.
I think back to my 2005 E46 M3 ZCP 6sp manual ... It only had one "M-button" on the steering wheel, no cruise control and the radio was an option. It was a sports car and it was a "de-contented" version of the standard M3 but with bigger brakes, lowered, suspension and wider wheels .... Sweet!
That was my favourite BMW and my Z4M-R is a very close second for the same reasons.
__________________

Current ///M: 2017 M3 Ultimate
Past ///M Cars: E92 M3 ZCP 'CDN LRP' … E85 Z4M-R ... E92 M3 ZCP Frozen ... E90 M3 ... E46 M3 Cab ... E46 M3 ZCP ... E46 M3

Last edited by scrammer; 07-20-2017 at 12:05 PM..
Appreciate 1
NickyC17334.00
Closed Thread

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:28 AM.




bmw
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST