Quote:
Originally Posted by NorCalAthlete
Couple things here...
1. This is the proverbial shotgun blast I'm referencing. While narrower than others I've seen (400+ applications with similarly low interviews / offers)...for comparison's sake I had 1 internship + 2 full time positions (entry level and low paying, but still) prior to graduation. After graduation, I applied to maybe 8 places and got 5 interviews and 3 offers. Prior to college I did have several years of military experience too, which helped, but I regularly give talks on this topic to other veterans doing the same thing putting out 100s of applications with few calls back. The military experience is hardly a blip and often has no relevant technical skills that translate over, so it gets discarded / ignored anyway by recruiters. The bulk of it was because I did my homework and research (and admittedly less of it then than I advocate doing now).
While it absolutely can be a numbers game, without seeing everyone's resumes + positions they're applying for I cannot help but to be skeptical of the specificity of each resume and how good of a match it is for each position. Monster, perhaps you can shed some light here - was yours tailored to each position / person / company? Or just general industry / discipline? Also curious if you had warm intros vs cold applying through websites - were all 110 done online? Or did you talk to people in person first?
edit - I feel like it's not fair for me to leave out the timeline for me in this comparison. I graduated in August (needed that last summer class) which was a bit too late for the usual September start dates / May graduation hiring cycle, so I was researching / tailoring from about August to October and applying October / November. Got the offers in December / January, started working in February. So do be prepared to buckle down for a bit - even if it was 1 application that led to interviews and 1 offer, that process can take weeks if not months for a company. In the meantime you still have bills to pay, rent, food, etc. I planned ahead and saved for this, and student loans have I believe a 6 month window after graduation where if you're not yet working you don't have to begin making payments. So start saving now, take on that extra part time gig, plan your living situation, etc. I'm crossing my fingers OP will land this job he's already interviewing for - he's starting the process far before I did. A lot of advice is "lessons learned the hard way" so to speak, so while I learned some lessons the easy way / some the hard way I think it all applies.
2 + 3. These are solid advice - one of the companies I applied to but did not go with was Lockheed Martin, who offered a well-defined pipeline towards career advancement including Master's degree programs and partnerships. At the end of the day though their pay was lower than what I went with (for the bay area anyway, as I understand it they're far more competitive elsewhere and scale well) and my current company also has a great many certification / Master's degree compensation programs. When weighing companies, do look into career advancement and progression - graduating college is just the beginning. Now the real game begins.
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Hey NorCal, no worries, I don't mind sharing more for perspective.
I was graduating with a B.S. in Computer Engineering in April 2004 from U of M Dearborn, and living in the suburbs of Detroit. Lots of automotive companies, and Tier 1,2, and 3 suppliers in the area. But job market in 2004 was pretty poor in Detroit. After the 2001 Ford/Firestone fiasco a lot of companies were hurting.
I was not that smart at the end of College. I was a good, hard working and intelligent engineer (if I may say so myself, with VERY little bias
of course). But I did not take advantage of internships, and did not get any help from career services. This is because I worked 30+h per week in addition to being a full time Engineering student to pay for the education. Does not excuse me, I did not utilize the tools offered to me as a student, and that's on me.
So when I started applying in February of 2004, it was all cold applications. I searched the web for any entry level engineering job which loosely fit my field, and applied. At first it was a generic application. And when after 30-40 of them I got no feedback at all, or the John Dear letter, I started tailoring my resume to the position with only the relevant info.
A recruiter picked up my resume on Ladders or a similar site, and got me my first interview. I got the offer for a precision medical equipment company, but I would have had to move to Battle Creek for this well respected company, but it was less money than the stats said a new EE/CE grad should make, and all my friends and family were in The D area, so I passed.
Next interview was because my Senior Design project as well as a IEEE paper I published were specifically in the area of Tire Pressure Monitoring electronics. And in 2005 a new law mandating direct tire pressure devices was set to take effect in NAFTA and EU markets. So that was my foot in the door. Started in May 2004.
Also for context, 16 years later I am on a Ex-Patriate assignment in Germany as a leader of a team developing the next generation of Braking systems for one of the biggest names in the business. I've only worked for 2 companies since college. I've lived in Japan, spent a bunch of time in Ireland, got to visit India, Korea, China, UK and many other countries for business. And I got a M.S. along the way in Engineering Management, and the rest is history.
My approach after college is what I would call Buck Shot. And it was a numbers game to get into the business for me, with some tailoring and some luck. I would do it differently today, as you said. But that's the beauty of hindsight.
Also I’ve hired about a dozen engineers since 2015 both in US and Germany. So I also appreciate the advice you gave for the most part. I think the personal interests, hobbies and charities part is a bit much, and not appropriate to discuss in some countries. But most of what you said is very good advice. I personally don’t have a linked in or a Facebook account. I expect my candidates to impress me with quick thinking on their feet, and I use a combination of Triangle questions, softball and hard physics based questions specific to the science of the business.