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      10-02-2019, 03:00 PM   #23
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“Botham was the best that we have to offer,” Benjamin Crump, a civil rights lawyer representing the family, said at a news conference after the verdict. “But it shouldn’t take all of that for unarmed black and brown people in America to get justice.”

Mr. Jean lived in an apartment in downtown Dallas, and Ms. Guyger lived directly below him on the third floor.

Ms. Guyger was returning home from a long day of work when she said she accidentally parked on the wrong floor of their complex’s garage. As she walked down the fourth-floor hallway, she said, she did not realize that anything was amiss, nor did she notice the red doormat outside Mr. Jean’s door.

The door strike plate was defective and not fully latched, according to the defense, allowing Ms. Guyger to enter using her own keys.

When Ms. Guyger noticed someone inside, she said, she drew her gun and shouted, “Let me see your hands.” She testified that Mr. Jean was walking toward her and shouting “Hey” when she fired her weapon twice, striking Mr. Jean once in the torso and killing him.

“I was scared he was going to kill me,” she told jurors.

Her testimony conflicted with prosecution witnesses, including neighbors who said they did not hear verbal commands and a medical examiner, who testified that the bullet had a downward trajectory, indicating that Mr. Jean was either getting up from a seated position or was “in a cowering position” when he was shot.

After the verdict, Ms. Guyger sat quietly at the defense table. Her mother began crying audibly.

The jury, which will decide the length of punishment, began hearing testimony in the sentencing portion of the trial Tuesday afternoon. Ms. Guyger faces between five and 99 years in prison.

Prosecutors sought to draw the jury’s attention to past social media posts by Ms. Guyger, including a post, “Kill first, die last” that she had saved to a page for “quotes and inspiration.”

The prosecution also highlighted a text they said Ms. Guyger sent while working at a parade celebrating the Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. When asked when the festivities would end, she wrote: “When MLK is dead … oh wait …”
She also failed to render any kind of aid after realizing she was NOT in her own home and had shot an innocent human being. She spent several minutes explaining to 911 what happened, but did NOT bother to render any sort of aid to stop the bleeding.

This is a very good summary: https://abcnews.go.com/US/amber-guyg...ry?id=65978073

Also, the Jury were given clear details and understanding of the differences between convictions:

Quote:
The jury came to its decision after asking for clarification on the definition of manslaughter and a clearer explanation of the Castle Doctrine, a legal protection for a homeowner who uses deadly force inside their home against an intruder.

Guyger's defense team attempted to use the Castle Doctrine, which is similar to Florida's "stand your ground" law, as a defense, arguing that while she was in the wrong apartment, in her mind she believed she was in her own unit, which was a floor below Jean's. The prosecution countered that the Castle Doctrine did not apply in the case.

Before the jurors began deliberations, Judge Kemp gave them a series of instructions, including offering the panel the option of weighing whether Guyger committed murder or manslaughter when she mistakenly entered Jean's apartment and fatally shot him believing he was an intruder.
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      10-02-2019, 03:21 PM   #24
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How does this work? How do you walk into someone else's apartment and not realise it? I've been sleep-deprived, batshit wasted, but I never had any issues identifying my own home. What drugs was she on and where can I get them?
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      10-02-2019, 03:23 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Blood View Post
I think the conviction will get overturned. I think (whether its the right charge or not) she'll be convicted of something. But outright murder is not the right charge. That was politically motivated.
Actually, anything less than murder would be politically motivated. Here are the elements for murder under Section 19.02 of the Texas Penal Code:

A person commits [murder] if he:
(1) intentionally or knowingly causes the death of an individual;
(2) intends to cause serious bodily injury and commits an act clearly dangerous to human life that causes the death of an individual; or
(3) commits or attempts to commit a felony, other than manslaughter, and in the course of and in furtherance of the commission or attempt, or in immediate flight from the commission or attempt, he commits or attempts to commit an act clearly dangerous to human life that causes the death of an individual.

Clearly Amy's actions fit within any of the above requirements (only one of the 3 requirements is necessary to be guilty of murder). Then the question is whether there are any legal justifications or defenses that would apply (self-defense, coercion, insanity, etc.), but I'm pretty sure none do.

Just for the sake of completeness, here's the statute for manslaughter (Texas Penal Code Section 19.04):
A person commits [manslaughter] if he recklessly causes the death of an individual.

The typical case for manslaughter would be a DUI, driving while texting, falsely yelling "Fire!" in a crowded theater, etc.
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      10-02-2019, 03:31 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Blood View Post
I think the conviction will get overturned. I think (whether its the right charge or not) she'll be convicted of something. But outright murder is not the right charge. That was politically motivated.
Actually, anything less than murder would be politically motivated. Here are the elements for murder under Section 19.02 of the Texas Penal Code:

A person commits [murder] if he:
(1) intentionally or knowingly causes the death of an individual;
(2) intends to cause serious bodily injury and commits an act clearly dangerous to human life that causes the death of an individual; or
(3) commits or attempts to commit a felony, other than manslaughter, and in the course of and in furtherance of the commission or attempt, or in immediate flight from the commission or attempt, he commits or attempts to commit an act clearly dangerous to human life that causes the death of an individual.

Clearly Amy's actions fit within any of the above requirements (only one of the 3 requirements is necessary to be guilty of murder). Then the question is whether there are any legal justifications or defenses that would apply (self-defense, coercion, insanity, etc.), but I'm pretty sure none do.

Just for the sake of completeness, here's the statute for manslaughter (Texas Penal Code Section 19.04):
A person commits [manslaughter] if he recklessly causes the death of an individual.

The typical case for manslaughter would be a DUI, driving while texting, falsely yelling "Fire!" in a crowded theater, etc.
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      10-02-2019, 03:48 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Blood View Post
I think the conviction will get overturned. I think (whether its the right charge or not) she'll be convicted of something. But outright murder is not the right charge. That was politically motivated.
Actually, anything less than murder would be politically motivated. Here are the elements for murder under Section 19.02 of the Texas Penal Code:

A person commits [murder] if he:
(1) intentionally or knowingly causes the death of an individual;
(2) intends to cause serious bodily injury and commits an act clearly dangerous to human life that causes the death of an individual; or
(3) commits or attempts to commit a felony, other than manslaughter, and in the course of and in furtherance of the commission or attempt, or in immediate flight from the commission or attempt, he commits or attempts to commit an act clearly dangerous to human life that causes the death of an individual.

Clearly Amy's actions fit within all 3 of the above requirements (only one of the 3 requirements is necessary to be guilty of murder). Then the question is whether there are any legal justifications or defenses that would apply (self-defense, coercion, insanity, etc.), but I'm pretty sure none do.

Just for the sake of completeness, here's the statute for manslaughter (Texas Penal Code Section 19.04):
A person commits [manslaughter] if he recklessly causes the death of an individual.

The typical case for manslaughter would be a DUI, driving while texting, falsely yelling "Fire!" in a crowded theater, etc.
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      10-02-2019, 03:49 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Blood View Post
I think the conviction will get overturned. I think (whether its the right charge or not) she'll be convicted of something. But outright murder is not the right charge. That was politically motivated.
Actually, anything less than murder would be politically motivated. Here are the elements for murder under Section 19.02 of the Texas Penal Code:

A person commits [murder] if he:
(1) intentionally or knowingly causes the death of an individual;
(2) intends to cause serious bodily injury and commits an act clearly dangerous to human life that causes the death of an individual; or
(3) commits or attempts to commit a felony, other than manslaughter, and in the course of and in furtherance of the commission or attempt, or in immediate flight from the commission or attempt, he commits or attempts to commit an act clearly dangerous to human life that causes the death of an individual.

Clearly Amy's actions fit within all 3 of the above requirements (only one of the 3 requirements is necessary to be guilty of murder). Then the question is whether there are any legal justifications or defenses that would apply (self-defense, coercion, insanity, etc.), but I'm pretty sure none do.

Just for the sake of completeness, here's the statute for manslaughter (Texas Penal Code Section 19.04):
A person commits [manslaughter] if he recklessly causes the death of an individual.

The typical case for manslaughter would be a DUI, driving while texting, falsely yelling "Fire!" in a crowded theater, etc. That's not this.
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      10-02-2019, 03:52 PM   #29
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Here's a really good definition between the 2 charges.

https://criminal.laws.com/murder/manslaughter-vs-murder

The primary distinction between murder and manslaughter is that murder has a specific intent to kill. The act of murder is filled with malice, while a death from manslaughter is charged when the malicious action cannot be established.
The presence of malicious intent refers to the actions taken by the murderer before the violence took place. A murder is a predetermined act of violence. A murder occurs after a thought out plan and the acquisition of specific accessories or weaponry. In contrast, manslaughter does not contain such premeditation. Manslaughter is thus being held responsible for killing another human being without intent or malice.

For those who think this is murder, take out your emotional thoughts, and explain how this fits the category of murder?
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      10-02-2019, 05:01 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Run Silent View Post
I worked with the victim at my previous employer. Nothing you said makes any sense. He was nothing more than a nice, polite, quiet CPA.

I think she absolutely needs to go to jail, and I certainly think she is guilty of manslaughter, but there was no plan to actively go over to this guys apartment and shoot him, at least I don't think so.

I think she was just an idiot and made a massive mistake and killed a very nice and innocent man.
I think you misunderstand. I am not saying he did anything wrong.
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      10-02-2019, 05:15 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by schoy View Post
Actually, anything less than murder would be politically motivated. Here are the elements for murder under Section 19.02 of the Texas Penal Code:

A person commits [murder] if he:
(1) intentionally or knowingly causes the death of an individual;
(2) intends to cause serious bodily injury and commits an act clearly dangerous to human life that causes the death of an individual; or
(3) commits or attempts to commit a felony, other than manslaughter, and in the course of and in furtherance of the commission or attempt, or in immediate flight from the commission or attempt, he commits or attempts to commit an act clearly dangerous to human life that causes the death of an individual.

Clearly Amy's actions fit within any of the above requirements (only one of the 3 requirements is necessary to be guilty of murder). Then the question is whether there are any legal justifications or defenses that would apply (self-defense, coercion, insanity, etc.), but I'm pretty sure none do.

Just for the sake of completeness, here's the statute for manslaughter (Texas Penal Code Section 19.04):
A person commits [manslaughter] if he recklessly causes the death of an individual.

The typical case for manslaughter would be a DUI, driving while texting, falsely yelling "Fire!" in a crowded theater, etc.
Like I stated previously, I was discussing this with an attorney friend and, in his opinion, he didn't think murder fit (nor manslaughter).

Its obviously a terrible situation for all.
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      10-02-2019, 05:19 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Delta0311 View Post
This is the end result of minimum standard diversity quota hiring. Safe to say she was hired as a PO simply because the dept. needed to fill the vagina quota. Situational awareness if stressed to death in the military and in LE. You need to be aware of your surroundings all the time, no matter how tired you are. The fact that she could walk into a neighbor’s apartment and think that it is her shows she had no business being a cop. Right off the bat there would have been signs that said "hey dumbass this is not your flat", signs such as furnishings, decor, and possible pictures hanging on wall.

Now with the above said... No she should not have been found guilty of murder. Her actions were based on pure incompetence and there was not actual intent to murder the victim. His death was due to her error of judgement and not intentional homicide. I'm 80% sure she will appeal and get the lesser charge once this shit dies down. The fact that the bat shit crazy media wants to make this a race issue is nothing new.
I agree, how does someone with her training fail so badly. She would have been a crappy cop anyway.

Last edited by tdott; 10-03-2019 at 11:12 AM..
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      10-02-2019, 05:34 PM   #33
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She got 10 years. I believe with good behavior she will do much less than that.
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      10-02-2019, 05:37 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Blood View Post
She got 10 years. I believe with good behavior she will do much less than that.
Being a cop, she is going to get fucked up in there.....
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      10-02-2019, 05:52 PM   #35
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Brother of victim spoke in the courtroom and said, paraphrasing, “ I personally want the best for you, I don’t even want you to go to jail” then he got out of the witness chair and walked towards the convicted they met in front on the bench and they hugged. What a gentleman. He also understands this was not murder, shame that others can’t see the obvious.
There is hope for race relations in this land.
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      10-02-2019, 06:05 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by N54Yankee View Post
Brother of victim spoke in the courtroom and said, paraphrasing, “ I personally want the best for you, I don’t even want you to go to jail” then he got out of the witness chair and walked towards the convicted they met in front on the bench and they hugged. What a gentleman. He also understands this was not murder, shame that others can’t see the obvious.
There is hope for race relations in this land.
Forgiveness is INCREDIBLY helpful for the victim/family. Now he can begin his personal healing. Not sure that race has anything to do with it in his case.
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      10-02-2019, 06:35 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by UncleWede View Post
Forgiveness is INCREDIBLY helpful for the victim/family. Now he can begin his personal healing. Not sure that race has anything to do with it in his case.
Agreed but I saw his face while speaking and it seemed to me that he knew she didn’t mean to do it. The hug kind of sealed it for me. I’m sure we’ll hear more from him.
Race was injected into this case from the very get go. Whether the black victim was a bad dude with a gun or an innocent man shot in his own home. Just one story of many claiming racists killing blacks.
https://www.dallasnews.com/news/crim...e-power-signs/
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Last edited by N54Yankee; 10-03-2019 at 08:04 AM..
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      10-02-2019, 07:06 PM   #38
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wow some very delusional posts in here.
MURDER

and she only got 10 years....

hate to say this, but flip the script, how many years would that black man have got? they would've sent his ass to the chair.
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      10-02-2019, 07:21 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TrevorM3 View Post
wow some very delusional posts in here.
MURDER

and she only got 10 years....

hate to say this, but flip the script, how many years would that black man have got? they would've sent his ass to the chair.


Let's see.... Imagine if you will just for a moment... What would have happened had a Black Police Officer shot and killed an innocent White Woman in her own home?

Try not to hurt yourself thinking too long.
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      10-02-2019, 07:28 PM   #40
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Am I hearing that correctly she only got 10 years for murdering an innocent man? Sorry but if that was my son I'd come after her and risk going to prison. I will protect my family no matter what it takes!
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      10-02-2019, 09:22 PM   #41
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If a man did the same thing to a woman in her own apartment, he definitely would get the chair. Why am I not surprised that the pussy pass is still being handed out like candy?
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      10-02-2019, 09:40 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by schoy View Post
Actually, anything less than murder would be politically motivated. Here are the elements for murder under Section 19.02 of the Texas Penal Code:

A person commits [murder] if he:
(1) intentionally or knowingly causes the death of an individual;
(2) intends to cause serious bodily injury and commits an act clearly dangerous to human life that causes the death of an individual; or
(3) commits or attempts to commit a felony, other than manslaughter, and in the course of and in furtherance of the commission or attempt, or in immediate flight from the commission or attempt, he commits or attempts to commit an act clearly dangerous to human life that causes the death of an individual.

Clearly Amy's actions fit within any of the above requirements (only one of the 3 requirements is necessary to be guilty of murder). Then the question is whether there are any legal justifications or defenses that would apply (self-defense, coercion, insanity, etc.), but I'm pretty sure none do.

Just for the sake of completeness, here's the statute for manslaughter (Texas Penal Code Section 19.04):
A person commits [manslaughter] if he recklessly causes the death of an individual.

The typical case for manslaughter would be a DUI, driving while texting, falsely yelling "Fire!" in a crowded theater, etc.
She recklessly put herself in a situation where she got scared and in that shock and fear she recklessly shot an innocent man. Without malice nor premeditation, a moronic position she put herself in. Manslaughter
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      10-03-2019, 07:56 AM   #43
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Just saw the continuation of the vid from the courtroom. After the victims brother said what he said and they hugged the black Judge who presided was crying at her bench then came down walked over to the convicted not the victims brother and cried and hugged her! Has anyone ever seen a case where the Judge cried and left the bench to embrace someone they thought was a murderer? I don’t think so. This was clearly a case of overcharging by the DA based purely for racial reasons.
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      10-03-2019, 12:08 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by N54Yankee View Post
Shouldn’t have been convicted of murder but rather manslaughter. Would have been a more fair charge but these are racially divided times which currently seems to dictate the direction of the judicial system
Wrong.
She broke statutory regulations and didn't retreat as required and rather than rendering aid, called her paramour to get his advice. This was murder and her callous disregard for human life is what got her.
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