[Tacoma]

Originally Posted by Germanauto

I'm so impressed with Toyota/Lexus. Just a handful of months ago it looked like their F division was going to die. Now we are hearing the opposite, that a slew of new F models are on their way. This IS500 looks sick as hell and wasn't good enough for Akio Toyota to be a true F. I can't wait to see how good the next ISF will be.

Sat in the new IS yesterday....I still can't get over the dated interior, both in design and quality (lot of hard plastic).

I'm not nearly as enamored. Their original 1st gen IS in 1998 was exciting and a good start to rival the E46 in terms of driving dynamics. But it's been a steep downhill since.

The current IS is the 3rd gen that began in 2013. For context, the E9x was still in production in 2013! Toyota has been sitting on their laurels since then relying on refresh of old platforms, old engines, old technologies, etc. to keep their good reliability reputation going. That's all they got now, frankly.

The IS 500 exemplifies this - putting an old engine in an old platform and calling this combination "new." The same V8 engine has been used for years on the LS, LC, RC-F and now the IS. Their F brand is weak, having no unique engines and, compared with BMW's M, is short on every performance measure except weight. The proposed LC F could've been their showcase for new Lexus performance technology but they abandoned it last year citing COVID as the reason. If COVID can kill this, it must have been another feeble attempt to begin with.

[stein_325i]

According to the latest rumors the Twin-Turbo V8 may be back on for the upcoming LF SUV. If true this could possibly as be the reason why Lexus is teasing upcoming F products as using this engine for one vehicle wouldn't make too much sense.

Lexus LF Large SUV Delayed Due To Twin-Turbo V8 Development Issues?

[bkfastwagon]

Originally Posted by Tacoma

I'm not nearly as enamored. Their original 1st gen IS in 1998 was exciting and a good start to rival the E46 in terms of driving dynamics. But it's been a steep downhill since.

The current IS is the 3rd gen that began in 2013. For context, the E9x was still in production in 2013! Toyota has been sitting on their laurels since then relying on refresh of old platforms, old engines, old technologies, etc. to keep their good reliability reputation going. That's all they got now, frankly.

The IS 500 exemplifies this - putting an old engine in an old platform and calling this combination "new." The same V8 engine has been used for years on the LS, LC, RC-F and now the IS. Their F brand is weak, having no unique engines and, compared with BMW's M, is short on every performance measure except weight. The proposed LC F could've been their showcase for new Lexus performance technology but they abandoned it last year citing COVID as the reason. If COVID can kill this, it must have been another feeble attempt to begin with.

I think you are underestimating the substantial portion of car enthusiasts who are not happy with the general direction of BMW and frankly the rest of the automotive ind. Cars are getting more complex (small displacement forced induction) and less driver oriented (self driving is the ultimate goal). Some companies understand this and to their credit they are listening to the enthusiasts. Porsche is an example- they went back to NA 6 cyl in their cayman/718 because that's what their customer wanted. IS 500 is not competing with the new M3. It's a classic 5L V8 matched with RWD in a compact sedan body. That's what the Lexus enthusiasts have been screaming for and they delivered. You could say manual transmission is badly outdated in 2021, but at least BMW understands its importance for the enthusiasts

[jpy1980]

Originally Posted by Tacoma

I'm not nearly as enamored. Their original 1st gen IS in 1998 was exciting and a good start to rival the E46 in terms of driving dynamics. But it's been a steep downhill since.

The current IS is the 3rd gen that began in 2013. For context, the E9x was still in production in 2013! Toyota has been sitting on their laurels since then relying on refresh of old platforms, old engines, old technologies, etc. to keep their good reliability reputation going. That's all they got now, frankly.

The IS 500 exemplifies this - putting an old engine in an old platform and calling this combination "new." The same V8 engine has been used for years on the LS, LC, RC-F and now the IS. Their F brand is weak, having no unique engines and, compared with BMW's M, is short on every performance measure except weight. The proposed LC F could've been their showcase for new Lexus performance technology but they abandoned it last year citing COVID as the reason. If COVID can kill this, it must have been another feeble attempt to begin with.

Speaking of first gen IS300s, I will always have a special place in my heart for one...and a lighter wallet =)

[Germanauto]

Originally Posted by Tacoma

I'm not nearly as enamored. Their original 1st gen IS in 1998 was exciting and a good start to rival the E46 in terms of driving dynamics. But it's been a steep downhill since.

The current IS is the 3rd gen that began in 2013. For context, the E9x was still in production in 2013! Toyota has been sitting on their laurels since then relying on refresh of old platforms, old engines, old technologies, etc. to keep their good reliability reputation going. That's all they got now, frankly.

The IS 500 exemplifies this - putting an old engine in an old platform and calling this combination "new." The same V8 engine has been used for years on the LS, LC, RC-F and now the IS. Their F brand is weak, having no unique engines and, compared with BMW's M, is short on every performance measure except weight. The proposed LC F could've been their showcase for new Lexus performance technology but they abandoned it last year citing COVID as the reason. If COVID can kill this, it must have been another feeble attempt to begin with.

You make good points, can't argue with any of them. But I'm just saying I'm happy to see them putting more effort now by dropping a V8 in the IS and them hinting at a forthcoming IS-F and other F models. But yes the cost cutting still shows because they did not redesign the 3-IS and instead gave it a second refresh. The interior is disappointing, powertrain carried over etc.

However from an enthusiast standpoint, who else is doing a V8 in their compact executive sedans? Overall Lexus really is doubling down on the engaging sport sedan thing while others are moving away from it.