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      09-26-2020, 10:21 AM   #67
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Thought we only had a decade left before climate change kills us all anyway
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      09-26-2020, 11:50 AM   #68
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There won't be anyone still living in CA in 2035 at the rate things are going.
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      09-26-2020, 12:09 PM   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maverik259 View Post
https://www.npr.org/2020/09/23/91620...e-cars-by-2035

California Governor Signs Order Banning Sales Of New Gasoline Cars By 2035
You must be the last person on the face of the earth, to realize the world is moving to electric.
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      09-26-2020, 12:24 PM   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheRealBob View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maverik259 View Post
https://www.npr.org/2020/09/23/91620...e-cars-by-2035

California Governor Signs Order Banning Sales Of New Gasoline Cars By 2035
You must be the last person on the face of the earth, to realize the world is moving to electric.
Your comment makes no sense friend but thanks for adding nothing useful.
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      09-26-2020, 12:31 PM   #71
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Originally Posted by subterFUSE View Post
There won't be anyone still living in CA in 2035 at the rate things are going.
Agreed. It's going to be fun to see how the Einstein Governor handles the infrastructure requirements for this shit show of a law.
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      09-26-2020, 12:40 PM   #72
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I don't any of us can deny what has to be done, but the issue I have is that electric , well battery electric is that they don't work for everyone.
For some they work very well but there are many for which it will not be as convienient as as combustion engine.
Ie they don't have the ability to charge their car at home as they live on a street where they don't have garages.

now whilst I accept that battery technology will improve, it's not there right now as regards the ability to recharge in a few minutes.

hydrogen fuel cells have my interest but the infrastructure doesn't exist for that as of yet. You still have to produce the hydrogen in a clean manner to make it worth it. Solar power would seem the obvious answer there and strangely enough many countries that currenty have oil are well placed to do that as countries have climates with lots of sunshine (not all I accept)
Whilst it would be a lot of infrastructure to build out, we somehow managed to do it with petrol. you think about whats involved, dig down far into the earth, sometimes under a sea, refine it and transport it thousands of miles away.

I don't see what the same couldn't be done hydrogen?

But yes I think we are in the swansong now for ICE cars. your last chance to buy a new car with a combustion engine, no speed limiters (coming here in the EU in a couple of years)

I've no doubt that many people will want to hang on to their cars but I suspect governments will force us out of them by way of taxes or charges in one way or another.

It's all rather depressing for us petrolheads!
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      09-26-2020, 06:25 PM   #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AP View Post
I don't any of us can deny what has to be done, but the issue I have is that electric , well battery electric is that they don't work for everyone.
For some they work very well but there are many for which it will not be as convienient as as combustion engine.
Ie they don't have the ability to charge their car at home as they live on a street where they don't have garages.

now whilst I accept that battery technology will improve, it's not there right now as regards the ability to recharge in a few minutes.

hydrogen fuel cells have my interest but the infrastructure doesn't exist for that as of yet. You still have to produce the hydrogen in a clean manner to make it worth it. Solar power would seem the obvious answer there and strangely enough many countries that currenty have oil are well placed to do that as countries have climates with lots of sunshine (not all I accept)
Whilst it would be a lot of infrastructure to build out, we somehow managed to do it with petrol. you think about whats involved, dig down far into the earth, sometimes under a sea, refine it and transport it thousands of miles away.

I don't see what the same couldn't be done hydrogen?

But yes I think we are in the swansong now for ICE cars. your last chance to buy a new car with a combustion engine, no speed limiters (coming here in the EU in a couple of years)

I've no doubt that many people will want to hang on to their cars but I suspect governments will force us out of them by way of taxes or charges in one way or another.

It's all rather depressing for us petrolheads!
Imagine all the carbon spent to make those Hydrogen mines, logistics, pumps, etc, that is also a part of the problem.
I'm just gonna attach a wind sail to my M5, LOL.
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      09-26-2020, 07:28 PM   #74
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Recall Newsom !
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      09-27-2020, 01:24 AM   #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AP View Post
I don't any of us can deny what has to be done, but the issue I have is that electric , well battery electric is that they don't work for everyone.
For some they work very well but there are many for which it will not be as convienient as as combustion engine.
Ie they don't have the ability to charge their car at home as they live on a street where they don't have garages.

now whilst I accept that battery technology will improve, it's not there right now as regards the ability to recharge in a few minutes.

Not only do the cars make little sense for many Americans based on their driving habits, but California does not have enough electricity to power their state currently. Rolling blackouts are a reality there, and that's before the added current draw of forcing every person into an electric car.
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      09-27-2020, 02:30 AM   #76
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveinArizona View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by eluded View Post
About time. It's easily doable if you have The means. I love how at the press conference our almighty supreme leader had a $100,000 Tesla parked next to a $60000 Tesla parked next to a $60,000 Mustang parked next to an $80,000 Audi all situated behind him. Yeah this is easily affordable for the average California. :
There are less expensive BEVs around and by the time this law takes effect, there will be many. See the Bolt, the Niro, etc.
See the press conference. I did not see any of the vehicles you mentioned parked behind our supreme leader.
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      09-27-2020, 06:06 AM   #77
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Originally Posted by 230iZTR View Post
This is a ban on new combustion engine cars that won't go into effect until 2035. With how much progress electric cars have made in the last 15 years, I wouldn't be surprised at all to see similar (or even exponentially more) improvement in the next 15 years. Its entirely possible that gasoline cars won't be relevant anyway.
However, we are assuming gas engines won’t make improvements as well, or maybe hybridization continues along with many improvements.
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      09-27-2020, 06:07 AM   #78
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Originally Posted by orbE46 View Post
Thought we only had a decade left before climate change kills us all anyway
It already happened. You are just following the white light now.
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      09-27-2020, 08:26 AM   #79
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Until they approve a few new nuclear power plants I'll file this under "feel good" progress.
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      09-27-2020, 09:31 AM   #80
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      09-28-2020, 12:39 AM   #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by F32Fleet View Post
Calif is still ICE centric yet they experience rolling blackouts. How many people do you think they need to loose to other states in order to be able to support an EV centric transportation system.
Ironically, more electric cars would help with grid stability. Everyone having access to a giant mobile battery smooths everything out like a buffer because you can plug into it for supplemental power when demand surges, and recharge when there's excess supply.
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      09-28-2020, 06:13 AM   #82
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Originally Posted by 230iZTR View Post
Ironically, more electric cars would help with grid stability. Everyone having access to a giant mobile battery smooths everything out like a buffer because you can plug into it for supplemental power when demand surges, and recharge when there's excess supply.
Do you think that that's what people will do? I suspect that many people will plug in when they get home from work, turn up the household AC or heat, cook dinner, do laundry the dishwasher etc. I'm not sure how putting potentially millions of EV's onto the grid will stabilize it. Years ago Toronto Hydro released a statement that said if 10% of the cars in the city were EV the grid wouldn't be able to support the loads. I could be wrong but I think human nature will be what it is.
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      09-28-2020, 06:33 AM   #83
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Well, most EVs can be preset to charge during off-peak-demand times. You just have to make that settings adjustment. One way to do that would be to charge more for electricity at peak, and less off-peak. Some areas may already do this.
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      09-28-2020, 07:28 AM   #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by F32Fleet View Post
Calif is still ICE centric yet they experience rolling blackouts. How many people do you think they need to loose to other states in order to be able to support an EV centric transportation system.
According to this California's population continues to go up, not down. https://www.statista.com/statistics/...in-california/


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Quote:
Originally Posted by Murf993 View Post
Do you think that that's what people will do? I suspect that many people will plug in when they get home from work, turn up the household AC or heat, cook dinner, do laundry the dishwasher etc. I'm not sure how putting potentially millions of EV's onto the grid will stabilize it. Years ago Toronto Hydro released a statement that said if 10% of the cars in the city were EV the grid wouldn't be able to support the loads. I could be wrong but I think human nature will be what it is.
Power demand also drops off early evening. Shouldn't be too difficult to figure out a way to schedule the recharges when peak goes off.

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      09-28-2020, 08:19 AM   #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 230iZTR View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by F32Fleet View Post
Calif is still ICE centric yet they experience rolling blackouts. How many people do you think they need to loose to other states in order to be able to support an EV centric transportation system.
Ironically, more electric cars would help with grid stability. Everyone having access to a giant mobile battery smooths everything out like a buffer because you can plug into it for supplemental power when demand surges, and recharge when there's excess supply.
Actually it wouldn't matter because the aging infrastructure is a large part of the problem. Never mind that EV's would have to be plugged into the grid and not in rush hour traffic during the times that the rolling blackouts occurred.

For decades it seems as if Sacramento is notorious for creating problems, having business solve them and then calling the solutions (aka Band-Aid) progress.
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      09-28-2020, 08:25 AM   #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David70 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by F32Fleet View Post
Calif is still ICE centric yet they experience rolling blackouts. How many people do you think they need to loose to other states in order to be able to support an EV centric transportation system.
According to this California's population continues to go up, not down. https://www.statista.com/statistics/206097/resident-population-in-california/


Attachment 2424544

Quote:
Originally Posted by Murf993 View Post
Do you think that that's what people will do? I suspect that many people will plug in when they get home from work, turn up the household AC or heat, cook dinner, do laundry the dishwasher etc. I'm not sure how putting potentially millions of EV's onto the grid will stabilize it. Years ago Toronto Hydro released a statement that said if 10% of the cars in the city were EV the grid wouldn't be able to support the loads. I could be wrong but I think human nature will be what it is.
Power demand also drops off early evening. Shouldn't be too difficult to figure out a way to schedule the recharges when peak goes off.

Attachment 2424545
What do they say about a sucker born every minute? (joking).

Net inflow/outflow based on household income would give us a better idea.
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      09-28-2020, 11:09 AM   #87
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I currently live in Southern California and let me tell you, I am not opposed to leaving this state at some point.
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      09-28-2020, 11:21 AM   #88
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It's not a real thing, it's just Newsom grandstanding to get some of the heat off of him for the wildfire mess we have out here. As long as he can blame climate change and look like he's doing something, he thinks the voters will ignore all the mismanagement in Sacramento.

This will never happen on that timeline - California doesn't have either the power generation capacity or the grid to power that many cars, and no plans or the money to get there. Our power company is bankrupt and doesn't even have the money to maintain its current infrastructure, much less build out for an electric future.

And if it did, I'd bet 2034 would be a banner year for ICE sales in California, kinda like how guns sales go through the roof anytime there's talk of gun control. Nature always wins out.
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