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View Poll Results: Would you rather?
Nissan Z 45 54.88%
Toyota Supra 37 45.12%
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      09-16-2020, 11:56 PM   #243
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Quote:
Originally Posted by heavyD^2 View Post
Busted! The reality is that this new (old) Z is nothing more than a 370Z with a new sheet metal, interior design, and engine as Motor Trend points out in these photos proving it's a 370Z;

https://www.motortrend.com/features-...arison-visual/

The 370Z was an ancient car already so this one will be quicker but there's only so much you can do with revalved shocks and springs on an ancient chassis as this car should drive basically the same as a tweaked 370Z. I don't know how they could justify charging $40k for a reskinned 370Z even with a new engine. It's the same damn car lol. How embarrassing for Nissan.
That's what I'm saying, with the same wheel size and wheel-gap, it looks like the same exact body shapes.
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      09-17-2020, 12:41 AM   #244
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Quote:
Originally Posted by heavyD^2 View Post
Busted! The reality is that this new (old) Z is nothing more than a 370Z with a new sheet metal, interior design, and engine as Motor Trend points out in these photos proving it's a 370Z;

https://www.motortrend.com/features-...arison-visual/

The 370Z was an ancient car already so this one will be quicker but there's only so much you can do with revalved shocks and springs on an ancient chassis as this car should drive basically the same as a tweaked 370Z. I don't know how they could justify charging $40k for a reskinned 370Z even with a new engine. It's the same damn car lol. How embarrassing for Nissan.
The underpinnings of the latest iteration of the FM platform is not bad TBH. It has a front double wishbone (or SLA) suspension and has higher potential grip limits (especially when you fit good rubber on the car) than the McPherson strut equipped 1/2/3/4 ers and the Supra.
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      09-17-2020, 06:45 AM   #245
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Quote:
Originally Posted by heavyD^2 View Post
Busted! The reality is that this new (old) Z is nothing more than a 370Z with a new sheet metal, interior design, and engine as Motor Trend points out in these photos proving it's a 370Z;

https://www.motortrend.com/features-...arison-visual/

The 370Z was an ancient car already so this one will be quicker but there's only so much you can do with revalved shocks and springs on an ancient chassis as this car should drive basically the same as a tweaked 370Z. I don't know how they could justify charging $40k for a reskinned 370Z even with a new engine. It's the same damn car lol. How embarrassing for Nissan.
That's not really a suprise either, the underneath parts and skeleton will be majorly from the existing Nissan part bins. With Nissan's current financial woes, I am suprise they even bother continuing the Z legacy.

370Z already has a fairly vague and poor hydralic steering setup, it suffers from ice mode after sustained braking (wheel well has ZERO venting), it suffers from fuel starvation on right handers (this is already from the 350Z, since YEARS ago from its saddle shaped fuel tank, with ONE fuel pick up, on one side of the car), unreliable clutch slave/master setup, at least hope the VR30 does not suffer the same oil temp issues as the VQ37

And I saw EVERY single one of these issues on mine, within 1 year of ownership, so I already question this new 400Z's reliability going forward... at least the VR30 should be good

Perhaps the shrinking sports car market may help its sales if they keep the ticket price down.
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      09-17-2020, 07:00 AM   #246
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Quote:
Originally Posted by supra93 View Post
The latest cover of BestCar.

I like this grille better than the concept car
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      09-17-2020, 07:21 AM   #247
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesNoBrakes View Post
That's what I'm saying, with the same wheel size and wheel-gap, it looks like the same exact body shapes.
Did you look at their comparison pictures? Even the interior is the same. It's a 370Z lol.
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      09-17-2020, 08:05 AM   #248
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There were huge amounts of complaints when Toyota/BMW built a car as the Toyota seemed to be mostly BMW but selling it through both companies and sharing development got it on the showroom. Now Nissan goes completely by themselves but the end result is not really a new car but instead parts off lots of other cars, same chassis with close to the same base chassis/mounting points, modified interior.

I give both companies credit for doing something in a market segment that is unlikely to make a lot of sense bothering with. It doesn't look great for this segment for the future. If there wasn't a Toyota/BMW partnership I don't think there car would have been built for either of them and if Nissan didn't put this together the way they did I think the logical decision would have been to abandon the Z. Not completely happy with either effort but better than the alternative of nothing.
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      09-17-2020, 09:34 AM   #249
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I agree that this effort is better than nothing and I'm sure it's going to be a better car than the 370Z but I don't agree with them jacking the price up for a re-skinned 370Z. If they could have come in at around $35k I think you could overlook the fact that it's a 370Z with a new engine. If it's $40K or more that's a hard pill to swallow.
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      09-17-2020, 10:01 AM   #250
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David70 View Post
There were huge amounts of complaints when Toyota/BMW built a car as the Toyota seemed to be mostly BMW but selling it through both companies and sharing development got it on the showroom. Now Nissan goes completely by themselves but the end result is not really a new car but instead parts off lots of other cars, same chassis with close to the same base chassis/mounting points, modified interior.
Toyota got flack because they have the financial means to do it properly, but didn't, at least that's my view. Would it have been as good as what we got had Toyota soldiered alone? Who knows, as current Toyota has had its high points (LFA), and low points (RCF) for all their R&D dollars.

I honestly give Nissan a break if it ends up being inferior, they had zero reason logically to make another Z, sports cars are expensive to engineer, they are never going to turn a company's fortunes around on its own, consider their current status, this was not rational. Glad they did to make another offering, I guess offering the new Z does generate interest with the brand at a time when its desperate for it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by heavyD^2 View Post
I agree that this effort is better than nothing and I'm sure it's going to be a better car than the 370Z but I don't agree with them jacking the price up for a re-skinned 370Z. If they could have come in at around $35k I think you could overlook the fact that it's a 370Z with a new engine. If it's $40K or more that's a hard pill to swallow.
Design cost is still cost, so is tooling for all the new sheet metals, Nissan can't exactly absorb all of that just for a vanity project, its low cost development for a reason.

And they charge more, because the entire segment has gone more expensive since the 370Z was first sold.
Consider their primary competitor are the Supra (starts at 57k CAD, and that's the 2 liter, to 67k CAD for the equivalent 3 liter), the European equivalents start even higher or at least float about 60k CAD.

The current 370Z Sport touring is still undercutting these competitors by quite a large margin (its 44k CAD here), so one can assume the 400Z will likely float south of 60k here, and therefore will still be reasonable compared to the very overpriced Supra.
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      09-17-2020, 11:00 AM   #251
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kyriian View Post
Toyota got flack because they have the financial means to do it properly, but didn't, at least that's my view. Would it have been as good as what we got had Toyota soldiered alone? Who knows, as current Toyota has had its high points (LFA), and low points (RCF) for all their R&D dollars.
I work in product and business development and being able to afford to do something isn't a good reason by itself to do it. From a business perspective you run the numbers with costs, price and expected sales and see how you think it will come out. Maybe for something like this Sales/Marketing adds in some value for the brand image in total or maybe these cars get people in the showroom. Figure all this out and if the expected numbers aren't satisfactory you don't move forward. Nobody says, "we have billions and can afford to waste some of it". As an enthusiast I may not like the end result but would do the same.

Large part of Toyota's success is they are smart with their money, enthusiasts call the Corolla, Camry, RAV4 boring but they have been very successful selling these boring vehicles to people that are looking for basic, reliable transportation.
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      09-17-2020, 11:12 AM   #252
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https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews...70z-road-test/

2009 370z base price $30,625

2020 370z base price $30,090 https://www.nissanusa.com/vehicles/s...70z-coupe.html

New car likely has better interior, engine, brakes and more? 12 years later (when the car arrives) prices go up. I also don't think we are just speculating on the prices.
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      09-17-2020, 11:29 AM   #253
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David70 View Post
Large part of Toyota's success is they are smart with their money, enthusiasts call the Corolla, Camry, RAV4 boring but they have been very successful selling these boring vehicles to people that are looking for basic, reliable transportation.
I had that point written earlier and forgot to add it back in...
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      09-17-2020, 11:56 AM   #254
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I like it. I think they will work on the bumper after some feedback (hopefully).

the only issue I see is they might make it heavier than the 370. the 370z wasn't bad at 3200 pounds. But if they make this thing 34-3500 count me out.

at that weight you might as well just get a used m2 or m4.
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      09-17-2020, 12:43 PM   #255
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VR30 alone is 100-120lbs heavier than the VQ37, not including intercoolers and other turbo accessories. Unless they do some major weight reduction elsewhere, which doesn't seem likely since we know it's just a re-skinned 370z, it will definitely be over 3400lbs.
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      09-17-2020, 12:48 PM   #256
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Humdizzle View Post
I like it. I think they will work on the bumper after some feedback (hopefully).

the only issue I see is they might make it heavier than the 370. the 370z wasn't bad at 3200 pounds. But if they make this thing 34-3500 count me out.

at that weight you might as well just get a used m2 or m4.
Car and Driver weighed it last year - Curb weight: 3327 lb https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews...l-test-review/
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      09-17-2020, 01:18 PM   #257
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400Z Production Colors Simulation Renderings

https://www.400zclub.com/forum/threa...enderings.112/

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      09-17-2020, 02:00 PM   #258
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Roadster anyone? A few more random rendering in the link below.

https://www.400zclub.com/forum/threa...e-z-proto.103/

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      09-17-2020, 06:45 PM   #259
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David70 View Post
https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews...70z-road-test/

2009 370z base price $30,625

2020 370z base price $30,090 https://www.nissanusa.com/vehicles/s...70z-coupe.html

New car likely has better interior, engine, brakes and more? 12 years later (when the car arrives) prices go up. I also don't think we are just speculating on the prices.
This. I bought a 350Z brand new in 2006 and it was juuuuuuust sub $30k. If we adjust for inflation, the car has done nothing but get cheaper. Itís getting a new engine with like 70 more hp. Itís no longer ugly (sorry 370z) I think a modest price hike is reasonable.

I did not have any of the issues the dude earlier had with his 370Z, despite dailying my 350z for almost a decade and a half. It was extremely reliable, though I did buy it new and kept up on maintenance. I also beat the shit out of it and had it sideways HUNDREDS of times. Just kept on keeping on.
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      09-17-2020, 07:27 PM   #260
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HasteN54 View Post
Do we even know a price yet? Current Q60 with RWD, VR30 w/300hp sits at $41K+, RWD Red Sport w/400hp is $57k+.

What are you expecting for $35k, ~300hp variant? I could see them coming in under $40k for a base model, and around or slightly exceeding $50k for a 400hp+ Nismo model.

Thatís how I see this being priced also.
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      09-18-2020, 02:37 AM   #261
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Originally Posted by FrostyDC4 View Post
That’s how I see this being priced also.
Nissan cannot compete vs the zupra, build quality, material quality, overall refinement, if they did it would undermine the point of this car, which is the same as nissan overall, decent quality at a good price and relatively good performance. I'd wager to say that the base car will be 35k, top model will be 45k, particularly if it is being built on a modified 370z platform, meaning the cost to produce this car will be a ton less of R&D.
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      09-24-2020, 04:58 PM   #262
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More drop top renderings.

https://www.400zclub.com/forum/threa...oto.103/page-2




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      10-02-2020, 12:49 PM   #263
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That ragtop looks like a Miata.

And to the naysayers, I'm just glad Nissan is coming out with a new Z. By themselves, at that. Even though it may seem like it's built on an old platform using parts bin parts, at least they are doing it. Even if Nissan was near bankruptcy, when you've had an injury, you don't just get up and run again. You have to rehab, crawl, limp, walk, then run. I give them props for even coming out with a sports car, something not with a large market nowadays, that has decent numbers.

Last edited by NytWolf; 10-02-2020 at 12:56 PM..
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      10-02-2020, 07:38 PM   #264
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I will need to see this car in person before I judge the front but everything else I like about the car. Hats off to Nissan for making it a MT and 6 cylinder.
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