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      09-19-2020, 11:38 AM   #1
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You can buy a Z4 with 6MT manual transmission in Europe and Australia. Why not here in the USA?? C'mon BMW!
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      09-19-2020, 12:34 PM   #2
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Its the same old story. No business case or enough sales to make one, even in EU, the manual is still paired to more "economy" engines and not the performance trims.

The roadster segment is sadly dying, however, Porsche will gladly sell you a Boxster and a manual transmission regardless of trim or engine.
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      09-19-2020, 03:06 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by jstein55 View Post
Its the same old story. No business case or enough sales to make one, even in EU, the manual is still paired to more "economy" engines and not the performance trims.

The roadster segment is sadly dying, however, Porsche will gladly sell you a Boxster and a manual transmission regardless of trim or engine.
My take is that BMW is underestimating demand here. I think they could sell a sufficient number of Z4s with 6MT to make it worth their while. But you're right about the Porsche Boxster being a good choice for those of us who want a two-seater convertible with 6MT. I'd just prefer to have a BMW.
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      09-19-2020, 03:30 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by AustinPowers007 View Post
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Originally Posted by jstein55 View Post
Its the same old story. No business case or enough sales to make one, even in EU, the manual is still paired to more "economy" engines and not the performance trims.

The roadster segment is sadly dying, however, Porsche will gladly sell you a Boxster and a manual transmission regardless of trim or engine.
My take is that BMW is underestimating demand here. I think they could sell a sufficient number of Z4s with 6MT to make it worth their while. But you're right about the Porsche Boxster being a good choice for those of us who want a two-seater convertible with 6MT. I'd just prefer to have a BMW.
I just wish they would have made a Z4 M! That would have been awesome. The new Z4 is a great roadster, but in my opinion, proper roadsters should have proper transmissions, and this one does not.
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      09-19-2020, 08:50 PM   #5
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I just wish they would have made a Z4 M! That would have been awesome. The new Z4 is a great roadster, but in my opinion, proper roadsters should have proper transmissions, and this one does not.
I couldn't agree with you more!
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      09-20-2020, 08:41 AM   #6
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The MT is only offered on the smallest engine version (20i), not on the 30i or 40i.
Given the small sales number of the Z4 to begin with going through the certification process for a MT version for the U.S. seems pointless.
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      09-20-2020, 12:49 PM   #7
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The MT is only offered on the smallest engine version (20i), not on the 30i or 40i.
Given the small sales number of the Z4 to begin with going through the certification process for a MT version for the U.S. seems pointless.
Then BMW should seriously consider incorporating a 6MT option into the larger engine versions of the Z4. Enthusiasts like myself (and there are many of us) would be ecstatic. Currently, manual transmission roadster buyers have only two choices: the Mazda Miata and the Porsche Boxster.
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      09-20-2020, 01:14 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by AustinPowers007 View Post
Then BMW should seriously consider incorporating a 6MT option into the larger engine versions of the Z4. Enthusiasts like myself (and there are many of us) would be ecstatic. Currently, manual transmission roadster buyers have only two choices: the Mazda Miata and the Porsche Boxster.
The F8X (M3/M4) had a 6MT option - in fact it was free. The DCT cost $2900 extra. According to BMW stats only 15% of M3 and 17% of M4 had the 6MT. That hardly makes it worth their effort to get that option certified.

I have always had manual transmissions (except for a 540i) and really disliked automatics. While I thoroughly enjoy the 6MT in my M4, I was totally surprised by how much I like the Z8F in my Z4. I think it is a great transmission.
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      09-20-2020, 03:05 PM   #9
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The F8X (M3/M4) had a 6MT option - in fact it was free. The DCT cost $2900 extra. According to BMW stats only 15% of M3 and 17% of M4 had the 6MT. That hardly makes it worth their effort to get that option certified.

I have always had manual transmissions (except for a 540i) and really disliked automatics. While I thoroughly enjoy the 6MT in my M4, I was totally surprised by how much I like the Z8F in my Z4. I think it is a great transmission.
Yes, BMW's automatic transmissions have come a long way and actually deliver faster 0-60 times than a 6MT. But that misses the point entirely! The fun of a manual transmission simply can't be matched by even the most technologically advanced automatic transmission. And I disagree that a 17% uptake would be too low a threshold for BMW to offer a Z4 with 6MT here in North America.
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      09-20-2020, 04:17 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by AustinPowers007 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by German1967 View Post
The MT is only offered on the smallest engine version (20i), not on the 30i or 40i.
Given the small sales number of the Z4 to begin with going through the certification process for a MT version for the U.S. seems pointless.
Then BMW should seriously consider incorporating a 6MT option into the larger engine versions of the Z4. Enthusiasts like myself (and there are many of us) would be ecstatic. Currently, manual transmission roadster buyers have only two choices: the Mazda Miata and the Porsche Boxster.
I actually really liked the car and if $$ was a consideration I'd take the Z4 40i with 6MT over even the Boxster 718 4.0L. No contest I prefer the B58 over the 718 4 cylinder laggy lawn mower though if transmission choice were equal in such a comparison.
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      09-20-2020, 04:36 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AustinPowers007 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by SakhirM4 View Post

The F8X (M3/M4) had a 6MT option - in fact it was free. The DCT cost $2900 extra. According to BMW stats only 15% of M3 and 17% of M4 had the 6MT. That hardly makes it worth their effort to get that option certified.

I have always had manual transmissions (except for a 540i) and really disliked automatics. While I thoroughly enjoy the 6MT in my M4, I was totally surprised by how much I like the Z8F in my Z4. I think it is a great transmission.
Yes, BMW's automatic transmissions have come a long way and actually deliver faster 0-60 times than a 6MT. But that misses the point entirely! The fun of a manual transmission simply can't be matched by even the most technologically advanced automatic transmission. And I disagree that a 17% uptake would be too low a threshold for BMW to offer a Z4 with 6MT here in North America.
Too lazy to look up the sales numbers, but what would 17% be in the US? 500 cars?
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      09-20-2020, 05:15 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AustinPowers007 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by SakhirM4 View Post

The F8X (M3/M4) had a 6MT option - in fact it was free. The DCT cost $2900 extra. According to BMW stats only 15% of M3 and 17% of M4 had the 6MT. That hardly makes it worth their effort to get that option certified.

I have always had manual transmissions (except for a 540i) and really disliked automatics. While I thoroughly enjoy the 6MT in my M4, I was totally surprised by how much I like the Z8F in my Z4. I think it is a great transmission.
Yes, BMW's automatic transmissions have come a long way and actually deliver faster 0-60 times than a 6MT. But that misses the point entirely! The fun of a manual transmission simply can't be matched by even the most technologically advanced automatic transmission. And I disagree that a 17% uptake would be too low a threshold for BMW to offer a Z4 with 6MT here in North America.
And your "disagreement" is based on what?
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      09-20-2020, 05:40 PM   #13
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And your "disagreement" is based on what?
My disagreement is based on the fact that 17% is not an insignificant percentage. It means nearly one in five M4 buyers opted for a manual transmission. Roadsters tend to be purchased by people who are true driving enthusiasts, so it stands to reason that the 6MT preference would be even higher on the Z4 than the M4.
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      09-20-2020, 06:18 PM   #14
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And your "disagreement" is based on what?
My disagreement is based on the fact that 17% is not an insignificant percentage. It means nearly one in five M4 buyers opted for a manual transmission. Roadsters tend to be purchased by people who are true driving enthusiasts, so it stands to reason that the 6MT preference would be even higher on the Z4 than the M4.
So your disagreement is merely based on your "opinion" with zero insight into how car cost and profitability are calculated, details and cost of U.S. certification requirements or any insight into BMW's consumer and marketing strategy?
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      09-20-2020, 08:04 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by German1967 View Post
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Originally Posted by AustinPowers007 View Post
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Originally Posted by German1967 View Post
And your "disagreement" is based on what?
My disagreement is based on the fact that 17% is not an insignificant percentage. It means nearly one in five M4 buyers opted for a manual transmission. Roadsters tend to be purchased by people who are true driving enthusiasts, so it stands to reason that the 6MT preference would be even higher on the Z4 than the M4.
So your disagreement is merely based on your "opinion" with zero insight into how car cost and profitability are calculated, details and cost of U.S. certification requirements or any insight into BMW's consumer and marketing strategy?
Yeah but buying into his logic would allow us to get a 6MT so I'll drink that kool aid
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      09-20-2020, 09:03 PM   #16
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So your disagreement is merely based on your "opinion" with zero insight into how car cost and profitability are calculated, details and cost of U.S. certification requirements or any insight into BMW's consumer and marketing strategy?
Not sure why you feel so compelled to be argumentative here. Car manufacturers, BMW included, don't always make sound marketing decisions that mesh with consumer preferences. Just look at the hideous grill of the new 4 series if you need proof! As you pointed out, nearly one in five M4 buyers opt for the 6MT, and BMW has seen fit to continue offering that option in the 2021 model. And it's a well known fact that roadster buyers tend to have a stronger preference for manuals.

So yes, it is my OPINION that demand would be there for a Z4 with 6MT based on having owned BMWs for more than 25 years and being in touch with a great many fellow BMW owners. Unlike you, I don't automatically assume that BMW knows best in having made the decision (so far) not to offer a 6MT option in North America.

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      09-20-2020, 09:31 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by AustinPowers007 View Post
Not sure why you feel so compelled to be argumentative here. Car manufacturers, BMW included, don't always make sound marketing decisions that mesh with consumer preferences. Just look at the hideous grill of the new 4 series if you need proof! As you pointed out, nearly one in five M4 buyers opt for the 6MT, and BMW has seen fit to continue offering that option in the 2021 model. And it's a well known fact that roadster buyers tend to have a stronger preference for manuals.

So yes, it is my OPINION that demand would be there for a Z4 with 6MT based on having owned BMWs for more than 25 years and being in touch with a great many fellow BMW owners. Unlike you, I don't automatically assume that BMW knows best in having made the decision (so far) not to offer a 6MT option in North America.
I have owned BMWs for almost 50 years and been in touch with thousands of fellow BMW owners. Since I don't make the corporate decisions for BMW, I don't make any assumptions about their knowing how to run their company. The 6MT is only available in the 2.0 Z4 which is not imported to the US. Therefore the US has no 6MT.

BMW must have each engine and transmission combination certified for sale in USA, which includes meeting emissions and fuel economy testing. This certification is time consuming and expensive. Limiting the combinations makes sense.

You have the perfect right to your opinion, but you don't make BMW's decisions.
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      09-20-2020, 10:38 PM   #18
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I have owned BMWs for almost 50 years and been in touch with thousands of fellow BMW owners. Since I don't make the corporate decisions for BMW, I don't make any assumptions about their knowing how to run their company. The 6MT is only available in the 2.0 Z4 which is not imported to the US. Therefore the US has no 6MT.

BMW must have each engine and transmission combination certified for sale in USA, which includes meeting emissions and fuel economy testing. This certification is time consuming and expensive. Limiting the combinations makes sense.

You have the perfect right to your opinion, but you don't make BMW's decisions.
You're absolutely right that I don't make BMW's decisions. If I did, there'd be a Z4 with 6MT here in North America, wouldn't there?

All cheekiness aside, I don't accept your "BMW knows best" premise. While I think they make really great cars for the most part, I don't hold the company in the same institutional reverence that you seem to. In other words, the fact that BMW has chosen (thus far) not to offer a Z4 with 6MT in North American doesn't mean that we should assume BMW made a wise corporate decision. Corporations make bad decisions all the time. I may not have been around as long as you, but I'm old enough to remember the "New Coke" fiasco of 1985. Nuff said.

Last edited by AustinPowers007; 09-20-2020 at 11:53 PM..
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      09-21-2020, 05:50 AM   #19
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This is not at all about defending "BMW knows best". It is a reality though that Roadster (especially 6-cylinder combustion engine) are a dying breed and will soon go the way of the Dodo (SLC and TT are already gone).
The Z4 would not even exist without the Toyota collaboration. For BMW it makes no economic sense to go through the U.S. certification process for to sell 500+ cars more.
M3/M4 are BMW's sports car icon. Hence, here it continues to make sense to at least offer one model with MT for the halo effect.
Done & out.
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      09-21-2020, 10:59 AM   #20
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Quote:
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This is not at all about defending "BMW knows best". It is a reality though that Roadster (especially 6-cylinder combustion engine) are a dying breed and will soon go the way of the Dodo (SLC and TT are already gone).
The Z4 would not even exist without the Toyota collaboration. For BMW it makes no economic sense to go through the U.S. certification process for to sell 500+ cars more.
M3/M4 are BMW's sports car icon. Hence, here it continues to make sense to at least offer one model with MT for the halo effect.
Done & out.
Once again, your premise is flawed. How do you know BMW would only sell 500 Z4s with 6MT in North America? You have no concrete evidence to back up your claim. The popularity of the 6MT on the current Mazda Miata and Porsche Boxster 718 refutes your assertion that it "will soon go the way of the dodo."
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      09-21-2020, 11:08 AM   #21
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For those of you that want one, I wish that BMW would sell it to you; me, I'm very happy with the ZF8 and would order that tranny regardless......especially if the 6MT was limited to the 4cyl.

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      09-21-2020, 02:24 PM   #22
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Quote:
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The 6MT is only available in the 2.0 Z4 which is not imported to the US. Therefore the US has no 6MT.
This is the main reason; BMW has decided not to import the 2.0 into North America (not just the US) .....probably because their marketing research tells them they wouldn't sell well compared to Europe where taxes and fuel costs are higher.

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