[BMW269]

BMW M3 E9X, 4 liters and only 420 PS. LOL

[Meeni]

This thing is probably faster than a 90's Ferrari :}

[KingOfJericho]

Originally Posted by Meeni

This thing is probably faster than a 90's Ferrari :}

But it's 2013 and there are family sedans that are faster than a 90s Ferrari.

[onehungevo]

The spoiler is terrible. I agree this thing needs more power to appeal to me. I might as well buy a standard brz with an aftermarket turbo.

[Nkc]

Originally Posted by IEDEI

LOL. so you think driving on a canyon or mountain road (aka "twisties") is once a month BUT you drive Tsukuba every day? cool story, bro....

nobody spends $25k on a NEW car to get the fastest track car in the world. People spend $25k to get a fun to drive small car with great handling......that's all that really matters. What i'm seeing here is an expectation that the BRZ would cost $25k and you'd get 300hp. Way to stay realistic...

I don't think anyone here expects a $25k BRZ to be 300hp. We're all quite fine with what they're doing, what's not cool is an STi that's not $25k while being 230hp. I still don't think you know what STi means.

Even a 1997 GC8 STi had rated power of 280 when it was actually around 300hp at a curb weight of about 2700lbs, quite similar weight as the normal BRZ. Its now 2013, and every STi that they have come out with is faster than their predecessor. Making a 2013 STi with the lowest HP ever seems kind of like a rip off and an embarrassment to the name.

[M3_WC]

It isn't a full blown STi.

The fact is, the STi website was updated yesterday with a few vague photos and this happened to coincide with the 86 festival at Fuji Speedway where Subaru unveiled their latest BRZ package. What a lot of people don’t realize or understand is that a “tS” branded Subaru and an “STi” branded Subaru are very different creatures.

Think of it this way. The tS brand from Subaru is like an M-Sport packaged 3 series, while the STi is the full blown M3.

Subaru have dubbed their new model the BRZ tS for a few reasons. There appears to be quite a bit of confusion among a great many people as to what the difference is between a “tS” and an “STi”. Well, think of a tS Subaru as the “Light Tune” version of Subaru models. The parts are still made by STi but that’s where the market placement ends. The tS moniker literally stands for “Tuned by STi” and in most instances, mods are restricted to bolt on accessories in the exterior and interior departments with a few in reserve for the chassis and drivetrain.

[imserious]

Light weight and balance only get you so far. STI was THE model everyone was waiting for when the original BRZ/FRS came out. Too bad it is more TRD than STI. As a car fan, I'm disappointed. Have a nagging feeling it had something to do with the Toyota partnership.

I guess we'll be reminded about how balanced the chassis is and how the rear wheels drive the car. Oh well.

[imserious]

Should have been $34k and 290 hp w/ track focused enhancements to stay true to the vision. That would sell.

Sufficiently more expensive than base, but offer a lot more performance. Not outrageous, but enough to be a serious contender and FI to allow for truly easy modding. Base model still has the look and feel, just not the speed.

Will be very competitive with every other $35k sports car. Wouldnt steal all wrx STI sales since the wrx has awesome 4 wheel drive and 4 doors. Would be like the e92 vs e90 a bit. They should bump wrx STI hp to 320 or so to create more space. One can dream...

[IEDEI]

Originally Posted by Nkc

I don't think anyone here expects a $25k BRZ to be 300hp. We're all quite fine with what they're doing, what's not cool is an STi that's not $25k while being 230hp. I still don't think you know what STi means.

Even a 1997 GC8 STi had rated power of 280 when it was actually around 300hp at a curb weight of about 2700lbs, quite similar weight as the normal BRZ. Its now 2013, and every STi that they have come out with is faster than their predecessor. Making a 2013 STi with the lowest HP ever seems kind of like a rip off and an embarrassment to the name.

I actually am not sure if you understand what STI means actually! STI is not simply about HP. I have no idea why you are comparing Imprezas to this car....totally different car in a totally different market.

it's like saying "why did the E46 M3 have 333hp when the E39 M5 had 400hp"----well because they were entirely different cars with different goals.

the BRZ is not a 'retro' car per se....however their goal was to do more with less power. that's the whole point of the car! I'm not sure what's so tough to get here.

[Prissy]

I agree that it needs more power...

[F32]

Originally Posted by imserious

I guess we'll be reminded about how balanced the chassis is and how the rear wheels drive the car. Oh well.

"Balanced" is another word for "underpowered."

[IEDEI]

Originally Posted by F32

"Balanced" is another word for "underpowered."

LOL.

no.

[F1Venom]

The E9x M3 does 0-60 in 4.7 yet is "balanced." This car should do it in sub-6 seconds for it to be a good car for the road. I hate slow accelerating cars and feel they're unsafe.

[Nkc]

Originally Posted by F32

"Balanced" is another word for "underpowered."

like how "cozy" is another word for "small." lol

[happos2]

I see this as more of a TRD than an STi (theoretically). STi has historically added more power and upgraded drivetrain / brakes. Kind of like what M does to BMWs or AMG does for Mercs.

I have driven the BRZ and while fun in the turns, on the straights on tracks it flat out blows. I don't think it needs to be uber fast, but balance out the increased handling with more power. My opionion.

And I hope they loose the park bench in the OPs photo.

[DASHOCKER]

weak sauce.

[Year's_End]

It's not an STi. It's been confirmed that this is the equivalent of an M-Sport/S-Line/AMG package, i.e. cosmetics, suspension, badging, etc.

It's still a fun car no matter how you slice it.

[Endless619]

Originally Posted by IEDEI

this car isn't about power. not sure why you guys are so obsessed with HP numbers.

cars like this don't need a lot of power to be 'fun'....if you've ever driven a Miata or a vintage sports car, you will understand this....

You are preaching to the choir here. Been there done that so yes some of us can comment because we want lightweight, high hp, and high tq.

Some of us have been through the modified S2000 and Miata phases almost a decade ago.

[Inspired]

what a huge disappointment. 230HP? I mean, come on. Even the normal BRZ,FRS was extremely underpowered @ 200HP. I understand that the FRS/BRZ isn't built for straight line speed but being a pure sport car having 200HP is pretty disappointing.

[CWysong]

there coming out with a new AMG model with 190 hp but its realllly good at turning! they also forgot to put the AMG engine in it, but thats ok too, the badge is really all you want.

But, one might say, this small AMG is only meant to turn, not drive fast!! Why would you always want a car that means fast to go fast? Just because other AMGs go fast, this doesnt have to, cuz its fun in the twisties!!

(sarcasm. replace AMG with STI an you have this entire thread)

[F1Venom]

Originally Posted by Year's_End

It's not an STi. It's been confirmed that this is the equivalent of an M-Sport/S-Line/AMG package, i.e. cosmetics, suspension, badging, etc.

It's still a fun car no matter how you slice it.

That makes sense... I guess even the Japs are sleeping with the Germans.

[Year's_End]

Originally Posted by CWysong

there coming out with a new AMG model with 190 hp but its realllly good at turning! they also forgot to put the AMG engine in it, but thats ok too, the badge is really all you want.

But, one might say, this small AMG is only meant to turn, not drive fast!! Why would you always want a car that means fast to go fast? Just because other AMGs go fast, this doesnt have to, cuz its fun in the twisties!!

(sarcasm. replace AMG with STI an you have this entire thread)

This post really doesn't have a point.