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      07-08-2022, 07:50 PM   #1
Geradeaus
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Z4 Manual

Based on the reply to a Letter to the Editor in the July 2022 Roundel it looks like the Z4 will be getting a manual transmission in the U.S. No details, only a statement that according to BMW insiders a manual transmission is on the way.

It will be interesting to see how it gets implemented- sDrive 30i or M40i, both, or a full-on M version.

Now the question: will I want it? Hmmm…
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      07-08-2022, 08:34 PM   #2
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I thought there was a manual transmission in the car with the smallest engine already available? In some European markets? Maybe they are just bringing that one over here?

But yes, I have always wondered how Toyota has been able to make all these changes to the Z4 without BMW ‘helping’ or making the same changes.
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      07-09-2022, 06:16 AM   #3
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I would be surprised if BMW did anything substantial to this car. With the sales volume, it doesn't make sense. Not that I wouldn't be happily surprised.

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      07-09-2022, 07:44 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CeEl View Post
I thought there was a manual transmission in the car with the smallest engine already available? In some European markets? Maybe they are just bringing that one over here?

But yes, I have always wondered how Toyota has been able to make all these changes to the Z4 without BMW ‘helping’ or making the same changes.
A manual has been available in the 20i model only available overseas. No manual yet in U.S. models though it now seems to be on the way.
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      07-09-2022, 07:46 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by CJ421 View Post
I would be surprised if BMW did anything substantial to this car. With the sales volume, it doesn't make sense. Not that I wouldn't be happily surprised.

Charles
I agree on no substantial changes, but the M level engine and a manual transmission really shouldn't require much modification as the manual is already in place in the 20i and will be available in the Supra. We'll see!
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      07-09-2022, 08:55 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Geradeaus View Post
I agree on no substantial changes, but the M level engine and a manual transmission really shouldn't require much modification as the manual is already in place in the 20i and will be available in the Supra. We'll see!
The 2.0 has a less powerful engine; I can’t see that gearbox being compatible with the 3.0. The Supra manual, while using a BMW gearbox, was reworked by Toyota to work in the Supra (as I understand it), and wasn’t a drop in.

While the Z4 benefit from a manual? I’m not so sure, even though Toyota think so [in the supra].
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      07-09-2022, 11:17 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by stlcdr View Post
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Originally Posted by Geradeaus View Post
I agree on no substantial changes, but the M level engine and a manual transmission really shouldn't require much modification as the manual is already in place in the 20i and will be available in the Supra. We'll see!
The 2.0 has a less powerful engine; I can't see that gearbox being compatible with the 3.0. The Supra manual, while using a BMW gearbox, was reworked by Toyota to work in the Supra (as I understand it), and wasn't a drop in.

While the Z4 benefit from a manual? I'm not so sure, even though Toyota think so [in the supra].
The Z4 sales would attract buyers that prefer a manual transmission. 😉
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      07-09-2022, 01:02 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by Westside Guy View Post
The Z4 sales would attract buyers that prefer a manual transmission. 😉
Much like saying manual cars are bought by people who buy manual cars? …

Of course, that’s true, but how many people who purchased a Z4 would have purchased a manual? How many people who didn’t purchase a Z4 would have purchased if it was a manual? Of those, how many purchased an alternative (manual), and how many purchased a completely different type of vehicle?

Really, it’s the latter group, those who didn’t purchase, that matter. Those that did, or are, don’t play into the equation (BMW already have your money). Would there be enough people who purchase to justify the development cost?

Also, Z4 vs a 2 seater roadster/sports car: does the Z4 benefit from a manual transmission, when bmw have so many good high performance vehicles without a manual, and don’t appear to suffer for it.

As a final thought, there are people who say they would buy a manual and those who do buy a manual. I suspect the latter group is small, and diminishing (availability, of course, a drive of that). The Venn diagram join between those two groups, I think is small.

This is an interesting topic to me as I have sold a manual car to go to an automatic in the Z4.
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      07-09-2022, 01:29 PM   #9
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I owned a 1996 LT4 Corvette with a 6-speed manual. It was a very engaging driving experience. I love my auto Z4, but it isn't quite so much a fully involved drive. As I no longer have to commute in stop and go traffic the downside of a a clutch is not an issue any longer. So I might move that way for the next Z4.

I've read that half the M car buyers opt for a manual. BMW may be planning to offer the final year or two Z4 with a manual just as an homage to the dying ICE cars. I guess it just is a matter of who runs the company- bean counters or driving enthusiasts.
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      07-09-2022, 01:36 PM   #10
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I owned a 2002 Audi TT coupe which only came in manual and I loved that car, but driving in heavy traffic in hilly areas got pretty tiring. I’m very happy with the Z4 automatic and I don’t think I would trade it for a stick, but I understand the appeal. I wonder how many of us actively use the paddle shifters? Sounds like a polling question I should go post.
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      07-09-2022, 01:38 PM   #11
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I already have a C6 corvette grandsport with a built 630hp engine and a manual. It’s seriously more engaging no doubt.

Thing is I enjoy the auto in the Z4 because it’s almost like it knows what I’m thinking. I imagine there is magic at play.

That said. I would trade in my Z4 M40 in a heartbeat for a manual m40i.
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      07-09-2022, 03:38 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SMD001 View Post
That said. I would trade in my Z4 M40 in a heartbeat for a manual m40i.
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      07-10-2022, 12:39 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Westside Guy View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by stlcdr View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Geradeaus View Post
I agree on no substantial changes, but the M level engine and a manual transmission really shouldn't require much modification as the manual is already in place in the 20i and will be available in the Supra. We'll see!
The 2.0 has a less powerful engine; I can't see that gearbox being compatible with the 3.0. The Supra manual, while using a BMW gearbox, was reworked by Toyota to work in the Supra (as I understand it), and wasn't a drop in.

While the Z4 benefit from a manual? I'm not so sure, even though Toyota think so [in the supra].
The Z4 sales would attract buyers that prefer a manual transmission. 😉
How is it going to attract buyers if they don't even know the Z4 exists?
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      07-10-2022, 07:43 AM   #14
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Full M manual Z! My 3 car garage would finally live up to its potential
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      07-10-2022, 09:54 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CeEl View Post
How is it going to attract buyers if they don't even know the Z4 exists?
A good question, but, I think, a moot point. People who want a 2 seater roadster/convertible will find them. Particularly in this day and age of media.

This is the same discussion on the Fiat 124 spider forums. Very little advertising means no one knows it exists. But does it [mean that]?

I have never seen an ad for any car I have ever purchased (anecdotal, to be sure). Looking at the sales numbers for bmw across the board, the compact SUV range seems to be up in double digits.

I think anyone who wants a 2/4 seater convertible knows where to look. I’m not sure how many people would move to a convertible from any other vehicle if the choice was suddenly available.

Maybe I’m wrong; I know I am certainly swayed by advertising (particularly product placement), it makes me want to consider purchasing something, but only if I’m in that market. Show me 10 ads for a bmw X series will not entice me to buy an X since I don’t want a compact SUV/crossover. It would be different if I was in that market, but I’d already have found the bmw as an option; it’s is possible I’d be swayed, significantly.
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      07-10-2022, 01:53 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stlcdr View Post
A good question, but, I think, a moot point. People who want a 2 seater roadster/convertible will find them. Particularly in this day and age of media.

This is the same discussion on the Fiat 124 spider forums. Very little advertising means no one knows it exists. But does it [mean that]?

I have never seen an ad for any car I have ever purchased (anecdotal, to be sure). Looking at the sales numbers for bmw across the board, the compact SUV range seems to be up in double digits.

I think anyone who wants a 2/4 seater convertible knows where to look. I’m not sure how many people would move to a convertible from any other vehicle if the choice was suddenly available.

Maybe I’m wrong; I know I am certainly swayed by advertising (particularly product placement), it makes me want to consider purchasing something, but only if I’m in that market. Show me 10 ads for a bmw X series will not entice me to buy an X since I don’t want a compact SUV/crossover. It would be different if I was in that market, but I’d already have found the bmw as an option; it’s is possible I’d be swayed, significantly.
There is a limited market for cars like ours and you are correct that those who want them know where to find them. Those looking for these are seeking a car that is NOT going to be a daily driver(present company excepted) but a weekend fair weather toy. The value of marketing is not justified or value added. Marketing has to go towards market competition and that’s in SUV’s.
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      07-10-2022, 05:39 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stlcdr View Post
How many people who didn’t purchase a Z4 would have purchased if it was a manual? Of those, how many purchased an alternative (manual), and how many purchased a completely different type of vehicle?
Me.

Slice it however you want, but I will only buy a Z4 if they offer the M40i or better with a manual. I’ll pay an extra 15k if they put an S motor in there.

BMW is missing at least half the buyers in the 2-seat sports car category right now.
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      07-10-2022, 09:30 PM   #18
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I'd be in for a manual. This generation of the Z4 looks incredible but the automatic kept me from pulling the trigger. I'm really glad I saw this thread because in my other browser window I'm actively looking at E93 M3s - the Z4 is infinitely better IMO so I'll be waiting with my fingers crossed.
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      07-10-2022, 10:13 PM   #19
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sign me up for a Z4M with a manual!!!
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      07-11-2022, 02:42 PM   #20
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https://www.bmwblog.com/2022/07/11/b...-transmission/
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      07-11-2022, 04:20 PM   #21
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The article also states, "The refreshed model is expected to arrive in late 2022, featuring a very mild design upgrade."

IMHO, that translated = LCI.
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      07-11-2022, 06:19 PM   #22
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Well, damn. Fingers crossed 🤞

And mild refresh is probably a minor tweak to the bumpers and the new full screen dash.
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