[hinckley]

Originally Posted by white2abbit

I think to rent a FUN car and drive it as much as you want for about a month you'd be looking at about ~$20K (and easily more), vs very little with ED. I rented an S4 from Sixt in 2018 for a week for about $1k, but that's about as cool of a car as you'll get if you want unlimited mileage. I rented a BMW M4 in 2015 and it cost $1/km over the 100km included (and manual wasn't an option). I put 7,500km on my M2C when I picked it up, so that'd cost about $7.5k in mileage alone.

Exactly. And it really is sooooo much fun driving your own car on the Autobahn, thru the Alps, around the Arc de Triomphe. Well, maybe not the Arc de Triomphe.

[chmura]

Looks like BMW lost a customer.

I have purchased and owned only 2 BMW's and both of those purchases were via European Delivery. I would never go to the dealer and purchase a BMW. How boring that is! If I want to do that I would purchase a Honda, Toyota, etc.

At least I got to drive on the Ring!

[///M4ster Yoda]

Originally Posted by Ibiza

This is the entire announcement, as GOLFFRR left this out:

Ultimate Delivery Experience Continues in SC as Sun Sets on European Delivery

European Program to Begin Phasing Out Operations in May

As the global market has evolved and BMW NA sales volumes have shifted more heavily towards SAVs during the past serval years, the Performance Center Delivery in Spartanburg, South Carolina has seen continuing growth. Since its beginning in 1999, Performance Center Delivery has grown to more than 28,000 vehicle deliveries, while European Delivery, which has delivered approximately 30,000 vehicles since the 1970s, has experienced a significant decline in participation. Although BMW NA has historically represented an average of 2,000 European Deliveries annually, such deliveries have declined in recent years to under 500. Based on these trends and long-term evaluation, BMW Group will end the European Delivery Program in 2020 and cease accepting reservations as of May 18, 2020.

PCD is cool and all but it's no ED.

Question for all. Volvo is still doing ED and paying for flights for 2 as well. How many NA customers are doing ED on a Volvo? Can't be many yet they still offer it.

This is the nail in the coffin for our time with BMW. After 12+ cars for our family over the years we are done.

-ED cancelled
-Terrible looking cars (HUGE Grilles, Lexus 3 series etc etc....)
-Nothing in their portfolio that I'm interested in. Basically there is someone else doing it better these days (Merc, Alfa, Audi, Porsche, Chevy ). You all get the point.
-Crap Electric cars if that's what your into
-Manual transmission pretty much gone.
-DCT gone for cost savings. Ultimate driving machines???
-AWD "///M cars". Again Ultimate driving machines???
-The new 2 series. I'll leave it at that.

Did I miss anything??

[drjoe66]

This is typical for the new BMW. They are going mainstream and they completely ignore the brand enthusiasts and do away with anything that used to distinguish the brand from Kia, Toyota, and the likes. A very sad day indeed. Porsche, here I come. And after almost 35 years in bmw's, I never expected that day to come.

[R N M]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

Well they already had more than a 75% drop off rate. What more hurt could they experience?!?

The drop off rate is very misleading.
If the X vehicles - especially X3 and X5 were made in Germany then the rate of ED would probably be higher than ever.

[ASAP]

wow thats sucks... never did get the chance to do it... and now that i can easily afford an M car, its gone

[CosmosMpower]

Originally Posted by Murf993

Porsche still has it available. It seems to me that BMW doesn't really want the premium service any longer.

https://www.porsche.com/canada/en/mo...imatevacacion/

No discount and the Porsche HQ isn't nearly as cool as the Welt. Stuttgart is more of a business town too, less stuff to do than Munich and surrounding areas.

[Mavus]

Originally Posted by Rvnmaniak

As a BMWCCA member and owner of eight classic and current models, I am no longer getting the warm and fuzzy feeling I used to have for the brand. Let's see. In the last year ......... no more national Oktoberfest meeting for BMWCCA, the advent of overly large and ugly kidney grills in spite of NOBODY liking them, the inability to order a manual transmission on most cars, the placement of the M logo on every single damned car they make (looking forward to the ///M328i XDrive?) and the ending of the European delivery program.

What next? Having to be waterboarded, eat bugs, and a stay at Guantanamo Bay for the privilege of owning an all electric 3 series? Maybe its time to shop around.

what next eh? ... x8 ///M

[mlust]

What a bummer. I wanted to do one with my wife for the M2 I purchased but couldn’t find an allocation when they first came out. So I purchased one out of state and we took the trip over to Germany anyways and rented an M3 for the two weeks we were there. It was awesome!

Ed is such a cool way to pick up a new BMW. I love reading through the ED forum threads and looking at all the pictures, exciting adventures and travels that someone has done while doing ED. I have talked to many non enthusiast about ED and no one ever seems to know about it. They are always skeptical. BMW should have advertise more about this program. Very sad to see this get chopped. I would have loved to do an ED for our future purchase.

[BMWCCA1]

Originally Posted by qba335i

As a sales person you have to create value/experience to justify the higher price. People are willing to pay if they see value. The internet made it easy to shop around - if you can't compete on price, you have to compete on service.

The bottom-feeders don't care about service. We sell plenty of X5 M50i and X7s to folks several hours away and make nothing on them, just to be competetive. The fact that someone will buy a car from 8-hours away simply means they've shopped everyone in between and price is all that matters.

I've also lost sales from people calling from hours away because the quote they already had was $2000 below cost, and yet they were still shopping. No one ever asks about service but eventually the model of sales you all deem outdated will mean as you travel there will be no BMW dealers except in large metro areas. We were Jaguar dealers once, too, and they chose the metro model and offered us to stay as a service facility without any sales. We dumped them. Porsche tried this decades ago when Peter Schultz was president. They wanted all on-line orders with factory-owned central distribution points and all dealers would simply be service dealers. Dealers refused and most state franchise laws prohibited it. Tesla started fresh with this model, without the service facilities. If that's a model you like, then more power to you.

I own over 20 BMWs and like the idea of still being able to walk into a local dealership and order a windshield for a 35-year-old BMW and get it the next day without paying shipping. That all goes away if dealerships don't survive.

Fine with me, after 44-years in the business, I'm done with it. BMW owners always joked the cheapest thing on a BMW motorcycle was the rider. Car owners know the cheapest thing on a BMW car is the nut behind the wheel. I just call it Wal-Marting of America. You get what you deserve.

[elitex]

Originally Posted by BMWCCA1

The bottom-feeders don't care about service. We sell plenty of X5 M50i and X7s to folks several hours away and make nothing on them, just to be competetive. The fact that someone will buy a car from 8-hours away simply means they've shopped everyone in between and price is all that matters.

I've also lost sales from people calling from hours away because the quote they already had was $2000 below cost, and yet they were still shopping. No one ever asks about service but eventually the model of sales you all deem outdated will mean as you travel there will be no BMW dealers except in large metro areas. We were Jaguar dealers once, too, and they chose the metro model and offered us to stay as a service facility without any sales. We dumped them. Porsche tried this decades ago when Peter Schultz was president. They wanted all on-line orders with factory-owned central distribution points and all dealers would simply be service dealers. Dealers refused and most state franchise laws prohibited it. Tesla started fresh with this model, without the service facilities. If that's a model you like, then more power to you.

I own over 20 BMWs and like the idea of still being able to walk into a local dealership and order a windshield for a 35-year-old BMW and get it the next day without paying shipping. That all goes away if dealerships don't survive.

Fine with me, after 44-years in the business, I'm done with it. BMW owners always joked the cheapest thing on a BMW motorcycle was the rider. Car owners know the cheapest thing on a BMW car is the nut behind the wheel. I just call it Wal-Marting of America. You get what you deserve.

Spoken like a true salesman. If I can save thousands then I am saving thousands. Why would I pay more when I can pay less? Better service? Most sales people forget who you are the moment you walk out that door.

Bottom feeders? lol. Sounds like you're burned out.

[Murf993]

Originally Posted by CosmosMpower

No discount and the Porsche HQ isn't nearly as cool as the Welt. Stuttgart is more of a business town too, less stuff to do than Munich and surrounding areas.

Sure, but you can get European Delivery of a Porsche.....and then you have a Porsche to drive around Germany.....Porsche for the win!

[Murf993]

Originally Posted by chmura

Looks like BMW lost a customer.

I have purchased and owned only 2 BMW's and both of those purchases were via European Delivery. I would never go to the dealer and purchase a BMW. How boring that is! If I want to do that I would purchase a Honda, Toyota, etc.

At least I got to drive on the Ring!

I see the Porsche in your second pic....you can still do a European delivery of "there is no substitute"....

[R N M]

^
I hope BMW gets rid of dealers altogether a la Tesla but the Dealer lobby is too powerful.

I HATE wasting 2hrs of my time dealing with sales ppl to go on a 5min test drive and the whole cat and mouse game in negotiations.

My recent purchase of my X3 M40i was amazing and it was my local dealer. Compared to other dealers, BMW ones are very good in my experience but still have long way to go if they want to compete with Tesla experience.

[Murf993]

Originally Posted by R N M

^
I hope BMW gets rid of dealers altogether a la Tesla but the Dealer lobby is too powerful.

I HATE wasting 2hrs of my time dealing with sales ppl to go on a 5min test drive and the whole cat and mouse game in negotiations.

My recent purchase of my X3 M40i was amazing and it was my local dealer. Compared to other dealers, BMW ones are very good in my experience but still have long way to go if they want to compete with Tesla experience.

So when I bought my 993 from Pfaff (largest Porsche dealer in North America) I spend hours with a classic Porsche specialist. Tour of the vault with all the vintage Porsche's, a long test drive and outstanding service. Every time I've been in a BMW dealership I felt like they'd rather not deal with me.....so guess who's getting my money moving forward?

[TheBingoBalls]

Originally Posted by elitex

Spoken like a true salesman. If I can save thousands then I am saving thousands. Why would I pay more when I can pay less? Better service? Most sales people forget who you are the moment you walk out that door.

Bottom feeders? lol. Sounds like you're burned out.

He's not wrong. You're looking at strictly as a consumer, he's speaking as a salesperson. Of course everyone is trying to save money, but there's saving money and then there's shopping every single dealership because you heard some Joe Blow on the forum got an amazing deal that you typically wouldn't get.

I work in the industry (not as a salesperson) and I've seen how both sides interact. Consumers like to complain about how the dealership treat them poorly but consumers treat salespeople the same if not worse because their attitude (and some are on this forum) is that if you don't give it to me, I'll go shop around at other dealerships. So you think most sales people forget the moment you walk out that door? It's the same for consumers - you're just one of many salespeople I can buy from - most are not looking for long-term relationships, most just want that deal for the next 3 years before they move on to something and someone else.

The whole industry needs to be re-worked. I'm glad that some dealerships are introducing the one price model and removing the negotiating aspect of selling/buying. No matter what the dealer says, consumers always think they're getting shafted anyway. Here's is my price (typically 5% off) take it or leave it.

[mckman]

RIP ED, you will be missed.

Made two trips and they were both awesome. BMW used to make you really feel like you were part of something special. Nothing like having an M car delivered at the source. Sorry, but performance center delivery just isn't the same.

[BMthusiast]

Originally Posted by Ibiza

I can see Germany tourism taking a small hit, as I visited small towns in Germany that I wouldn't had wasn't for ED and remaining within Germany.

Yeah that's what kinda bothers me about this. Taking away ED for NA also takes away from promoting Americans to visit Bavaria that wouldn't otherwise think to visit Germany. Visiting Munich for the first time in Oct 2010 I became a BMW fan after doing the Welt factory and museum experience, and also seeing so many different unique classic and modern bimmers driving around Munich.

[filet.M2c]

This is a travesty. I am so glad I did ED on my M2c, was seriously a bucket list experience and I loved every moment of it. ED was also the only reason I bought new rather than take advantage of no sales tax on used private sales in AZ. Definitely would have done it again in the future... guess BMW won't be getting my money, at least for a new car.



ED Trip:
https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1613697

[TheBingoBalls]

Originally Posted by Murf993

So when I bought my 993 from Pfaff (largest Porsche dealer in North America) I spend hours with a classic Porsche specialist. Tour of the vault with all the vintage Porsche's, a long test drive and outstanding service. Every time I've been in a BMW dealership I felt like they'd rather not deal with me.....so guess who's getting my money moving forward?

You're talking about two different brands/tiers and clientele.

First, you can't even discuss discounts - none of the Porsche dealerships in the GTA (and surrounding area) will give you a discount. If you get anything, it's because they like you but discounts are generally not on the table.

Second, if you walk into a Porsche dealership, there's a high chance you're shopping for a Porsche, you're not cross shopping much of anything - dealership or brand/car.

None of those apply to BMW/Mercedes/Audi. You will get people who will walk into these dealerships, ask and beg for below cost deals and want monthly payments you typically get with a Honda.

Two different types of consumers.

[elitex]

Originally Posted by TheBingoBalls

He's not wrong. You're looking at strictly as a consumer, he's speaking as a salesperson. Of course everyone is trying to save money, but there's saving money and then there's shopping every single dealership because you heard some Joe Blow on the forum got an amazing deal that you typically wouldn't get.

I work in the industry (not as a salesperson) and I've seen how both sides interact. Consumers like to complain about how the dealership treat them poorly but consumers treat salespeople the same if not worse because their attitude (and some are on this forum) is that if you don't give it to me, I'll go shop around at other dealerships. So you think most sales people forget the moment you walk out that door? It's the same for consumers - you're just one of many salespeople I can buy from - most are not looking for long-term relationships, most just want that deal for the next 3 years before they move on to something and someone else.

The whole industry needs to be re-worked. I'm glad that some dealerships are introducing the one price model and removing the negotiating aspect of selling/buying. No matter what the dealer says, consumers always think they're getting shafted anyway. Here's is my price (typically 5% off) take it or leave it.

I've tried it both ways. Tried to create a good working relationship with local CA's and they all got greedy. I even called my local Bmw CA and gave him plenty of opportunities to sell me more cars. I had already bought 3 M cars through him within 2 years.

Perfect example was when the new X5 launched. I wanted the X5 50i at 7% discount which is fairly standard. He started spouting off how the 50i's are rare blah blah blah. I made two calls, 1 to Houston and 1 to Chicago ( have family in both towns and visit there often) Both dealers offered 7% discount right over the phone plus any incentives. That was $6500 in discounts. So am I supposed to just leave over 6 grand on the table so some salesman doesn't think I am a bottom feeder????

Bottom line is that as consumers of course we're looking for great deals. As dealers, they're trying to make as much as they can from each and every deal. If a customer says do this or I'll walk then let them walk. There are plenty of dealers willing to make less on a deal just to move metal. Dealers can't complain about losing a deal at that point because that's what the dealer chose to do.

This is the definition of free market.

[elitex]

Originally Posted by TheBingoBalls

You're talking about two different brands/tiers and clientele.

First, you can't even discuss discounts - none of the Porsche dealerships in the GTA (and surrounding area) will give you a discount. If you get anything, it's because they like you but discounts are generally not on the table.

Second, if you walk into a Porsche dealership, there's a high chance you're shopping for a Porsche, you're not cross shopping much of anything - dealership or brand/car.

None of those apply to BMW/Mercedes/Audi. You will get people who will walk into these dealerships, ask and beg for below cost deals and want monthly payments you typically get with a Honda.

Two different types of consumers.

Not sure about Toronto but I got 9% discounts on a new 911 GTS back in 2016.