BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read
BMW Z4 Forums (G29) BMW Z4 (G29) General Forum Savagegeese Z4 Review: Better drivers car than M2

Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      08-23-2019, 10:10 PM   #45
F20MAW73
440i Gran Coupe, Auto
United Kingdom
875
Rep
1,295
Posts

Drives: 440i GC
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: UK, West Sussex

iTrader: (0)

I think the ZF 8 is a fantastic gearbox and works spot on with the B58 in this car having test drove it on all sorts of different roads and settings in the car. The want for a manual gearbox didn't even cross my mind.
Appreciate 6
SakhirM410783.00
city1991228.00
CH400EM117.50
maxnix205.00
      08-23-2019, 10:25 PM   #46
low135
Banned
2209
Rep
1,285
Posts

Drives: E88 135i
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Clearwater

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by 13blk335ix View Post
not a fan of how it looks. seen it in real life. honestly looks blah and wont age well. it dosnt draw your attention and make you say "that car is special" a manual transmission is a drivers car. bring me back to the 90s where you really felt the car and they are easy to maintain and work on.

bottom line this car dosnt fit the price tag. my tuned f30 335i 6mt would gap this hard. and ive only got fueling and simple bolt ons.

my car is 2013 f30 n55 335i xdrive manual black and feels like it could handle 200 miles per. im getting more enjoyment at a fraction of the price.

seems to be a band wagon of praisers for these automatic transmissions. sure theyre better than they have ever been but nothing beats popping that clutch and bangin through six gears. then dropping two gears and reving through the power band.
Bruh, your bolt on N55 couldn't touch a tune only B58 : goofy ass statement
Appreciate 2
      08-23-2019, 10:34 PM   #47
10"
Colonel
10"'s Avatar
No_Country
4946
Rep
2,262
Posts

Drives: orange BMW 1M.
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: world

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by mdk135i View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by 10" View Post
When the 'best' drivers car BMW has a terrible 8 speed ZF gearbox there are 2 possibilities

1. The reviewer is questionable
2. This brand have lost their way

Or
3. Both!
I am a manual driver, always will be. I've since returned to my 135i however, the ZF 8sp in my Giulia lease really impressed me. Fast shifts, good logic, and smooth everyday operation. I especially love how it shifted like a manual car instead of meshing gears together. While the ZF is no 6sp row and go, it certainly is a fantastic modern automatic.
I've driven a Giulia for the weekend. The car was superb...the transmission was lousy. The 8 speed ZF is such a mediocre and ordinary automatic to me—-it even has a kickback like my father's old 1990 Camry. Just woeful. Have had plenty of 8 speed ZF cars as loaners and they were all the same. Just dull to me..

Manual is the way. If an automatic is really needed then any real performance car should have a dual clutch or something clever not just a cost cutting torque converted slushbox...
__________________
don't read this. too late...
Appreciate 0
      08-23-2019, 10:43 PM   #48
kinimod
Lieutenant
134
Rep
480
Posts

Drives: 911 GT3
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Bay Area, CA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by German1967 View Post
LOL... troll!
Read more comments in this thread and see that many think the same. Are we trolls or is there a real possibility that the ZF transmission is just terrible choice for a sports car?
Appreciate 1
10"4946.00
      08-24-2019, 02:43 AM   #49
Poochie
Luxury at the redline :)
Poochie's Avatar
United_States
9099
Rep
7,563
Posts

Drives: 2016 M2
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: NYC

iTrader: (3)

Quote:
Originally Posted by duder13 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by SakhirM4 View Post
Of course you know that the ZF8 in your X3 and the ZF8 in the Z4 are not exactly the same transmission.
Sure, but people often comment how great that transmission is relative to others. I've driven Lamborghini's with paddle shifters, Porsche's PDK, etc., and I don't have any interest in anything other than a manual. It largely defeats the fun of a sports car, to me.


Real talk, I myself, have tried & driven like 10 different DCTs & ZF8s equipped vehicles, with a completely open-mind and absolutely no bias whatsoever but the honest truth is; the paddle shifters gets old, very fast. I just end up leaving it in auto and let the computer do its thing.

The manual/auto argument is so perplexing. You cannot convince me that the ZF8 is more entertaining, when I experience the monotony myself, first hand. It's like looking at the sky and seeing that it's clearly blue but some folks are attempting to try to make you believe it's pink.

I don't know why it's so hard for some people to understand that an auto, as efficient as it is and always would be, doesn't afford the same visceral feedback you get from a stick..

I've come to the conclusion that the manual naysayers either can't drive stick or are just in strait denial, for whatever that reason might be..
Appreciate 6
smknjoe234.00
10"4946.00
duder13767.00
The_Werm212.00
wknddrivr463.00
      08-24-2019, 06:42 AM   #50
German1967
Captain
German1967's Avatar
United_States
579
Rep
829
Posts

Drives: 2015 M235xi - 2022 992 C2S Cab
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Ohio

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by kinimod View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by German1967 View Post
LOL... troll!
Read more comments in this thread and see that many think the same. Are we trolls or is there a real possibility that the ZF transmission is just terrible choice for a sports car?
Have you driven the M40i with the ZF?
__________________
Hoc Lapidem Non Vi Sed Saepe Cadendo!
Appreciate 1
530iDriver1707.50
      08-24-2019, 07:18 AM   #51
SakhirM4
Major General
SakhirM4's Avatar
United_States
10783
Rep
8,852
Posts

Drives: '15 SO M4/'20 Z4 M40i
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Austin, TX

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2020 BMW Z4 M40i  [10.00]
2015 BMW M4  [8.76]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Poochie View Post


Real talk, I myself, have tried & driven like 10 different DCTs & ZF8s equipped vehicles, with a completely open-mind and absolutely no bias whatsoever but the honest truth is; the paddle shifters gets old, very fast. I just end up leaving it in auto and let the computer do its thing.

The manual/auto argument is so perplexing. You cannot convince me that the ZF8 is more entertaining, when I experience the monotony myself, first hand. It's like looking at the sky and seeing that it's clearly blue but some folks are attempting to try to make you believe it's pink.

I don't know why it's so hard for some people to understand that an auto, as efficient as it is and always would be, doesn't afford the same visceral feedback you get from a stick..

I've come to the conclusion that the manual naysayers either can't drive stick or are just in strait denial, for whatever that reason might be..
I am not a manual naysayer in any way - as I said in an earlier post, 16 of my 18 BMWs have been manual, including my current M4. What I am is someone that refuses to write off a very good car because it happens to have a ZF in it. I am looking forward to getting my Z4 that is on order and am looking forward to owning/driving it, despite the fact that it was not available with a manual. I just think that people that are "manual or nothing" in mantality are being very narrow minded. We are not talking about Powerglides or Dynaflows here.
__________________
Tejas Chapter, BMW CCA, mem #23915, President 27 years, www.tejaschapter.org
Appreciate 3
530iDriver1707.50
EvenKeel418.00
      08-24-2019, 08:53 AM   #52
F32Fleet
Lieutenant General
F32Fleet's Avatar
United_States
3540
Rep
10,327
Posts

Drives: 2015 435i
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Southeastern US

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by 10" View Post
When the 'best' drivers car BMW has a terrible 8 speed ZF gearbox there are 2 possibilities

1. The reviewer is questionable
2. This brand have lost their way

Or
3. Both!
What? The ZF8HP is possibly the best AT ever made.
__________________
"Drive more, worry less. "

435i, MPPK, MPE, M-Sport Line
Appreciate 2
      08-24-2019, 09:04 AM   #53
GOLFFRR
GOLFFRR's Avatar
10711
Rep
27,529
Posts

Drives: GOLFFRR cart
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: we sell BMWs to "ALL" US states

iTrader: (4)

we need the M version!
__________________

BEFORE YOU BUY YOUR NEXT BMW, EMAIL OUR GUY KOTE FIRST!
Kote M Sales:Kotem@bmwofcamarillo.com Cell:805-368-9101
vipfinance@bmwofcamarillo.com for warranties!
Appreciate 0
      08-24-2019, 09:07 AM   #54
F20MAW73
440i Gran Coupe, Auto
United Kingdom
875
Rep
1,295
Posts

Drives: 440i GC
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: UK, West Sussex

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by GOLFFRR View Post
we need the M version!
Why some reviews are stating it is already better than the M2?
Appreciate 1
GOLFFRR10710.50
      08-24-2019, 09:15 AM   #55
antzcrashing
Brigadier General
antzcrashing's Avatar
United_States
1875
Rep
3,200
Posts

Drives: 2018 BMW 440i GC
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Eastern MA

iTrader: (1)

Garage List
I dont believe it is on par with M2 for a second
Appreciate 1
stein_325i25051.00
      08-24-2019, 09:49 AM   #56
F20MAW73
440i Gran Coupe, Auto
United Kingdom
875
Rep
1,295
Posts

Drives: 440i GC
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: UK, West Sussex

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by antzcrashing View Post
I dont believe it is on par with M2 for a second
The lap times are more impressive and according to the review its a better drive.
__________________
Z4M40i Black Sapphire
Appreciate 0
      08-24-2019, 09:58 AM   #57
babaikram
M6GCComp, Porsche Cayman S PDK, Peug 208 GT1 BPS
United Kingdom
512
Rep
1,280
Posts

Drives: .
Join Date: May 2015
Location: England

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by SakhirM4 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by duder13 View Post
I think that's the point. Porsche, Lotus, some BMWs, a few muscle cars, the Miata...that's mostly it. The Alfa 4C, Alpine A110, and Supra/Z4 twins really dropped the ball on that one.

As for the ZF 8-speed, we had one in our X3, and I'd never chose it over a manual. Heck, I'd rather have a manual Miata than any 8-speed/DCT BMW.
Of course you know that the ZF8 in your X3 and the ZF8 in the Z4 are not exactly the same transmission.
That is the point. A lot of people especially in the UK do not know there are two variants of ZF8. The upgraded Sport Automatic ZF8 and the ordinary automatic ZF8. Even for 2018 m240i in the UK you have to pay to get the upgraded version.
__________________
Acceleration is heavenly
Appreciate 0
      08-24-2019, 10:01 AM   #58
10"
Colonel
10"'s Avatar
No_Country
4946
Rep
2,262
Posts

Drives: orange BMW 1M.
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: world

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Poochie View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by duder13 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by SakhirM4 View Post
Of course you know that the ZF8 in your X3 and the ZF8 in the Z4 are not exactly the same transmission.
Sure, but people often comment how great that transmission is relative to others. I've driven Lamborghini's with paddle shifters, Porsche's PDK, etc., and I don't have any interest in anything other than a manual. It largely defeats the fun of a sports car, to me.


Real talk, I myself, have tried & driven like 10 different DCTs & ZF8s equipped vehicles, with a completely open-mind and absolutely no bias whatsoever but the honest truth is; the paddle shifters gets old, very fast. I just end up leaving it in auto and let the computer do its thing.

The manual/auto argument is so perplexing. You cannot convince me that the ZF8 is more entertaining, when I experience the monotony myself, first hand. It's like looking at the sky and seeing that it's clearly blue but some folks are attempting to try to make you believe it's pink.

I don't know why it's so hard for some people to understand that an auto, as efficient as it is and always would be, doesn't afford the same visceral feedback you get from a stick..

I've come to the conclusion that the manual naysayers either can't drive stick or are just in strait denial, for whatever that reason might be..
This.

Amazing how some people accept such a humdrum gearbox like the ZF. It's beyond ordinary. When I drove the M235 and M240 I didn't really enjoy them very much but easily one of the worst things about them was the terrible ZF gearbox. Felt 0% like a performance car gearbox.
__________________
don't read this. too late...
Appreciate 3
Poochie9099.00
duder13767.00
wknddrivr463.00
      08-24-2019, 10:20 AM   #59
TodmordenLad
Brigadier General
United Kingdom
2746
Rep
3,906
Posts

Drives: Audi A4 Avant
Join Date: May 2015
Location: UK

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by F20MAW73 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by antzcrashing View Post
I dont believe it is on par with M2 for a second
The lap times are more impressive and according to the review its a better drive.
No surprise: lower CoG, wider tracks, lighter, more streamlined, better suspension components
__________________
Owned: 440i GC LCI with MPPSK, F31 330D M Sport with MPPK, F11 530D SE, F11 520D SE, E61 530D M Sport, E36 325i plus many MB's, Audi's & Volvo's
Appreciate 1
530iDriver1707.50
      08-24-2019, 10:58 AM   #60
duder13
Captain
duder13's Avatar
767
Rep
904
Posts

Drives: Cashmere
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: US

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by ///M TOWN View Post
You better vote with your wallet.

Regardless those days are numbered.
What's funny is that the head of BMW M, Markus Flasch, just said this last month:

"Manual is very important. The manual stick shift is not a performance-bringer, because an automatic transmission is just faster, you can ask any race driver. But it gives the vehicle character and I kind of compare it to people who love mechanical watches; it isn’t more precise and it doesn’t have any advantage at all but it’s a character feature. So is a stick shift."

I guess that's why the Z4/Supra will never be a true M car.

Last edited by duder13; 08-24-2019 at 11:55 AM..
Appreciate 0
      08-24-2019, 11:55 AM   #61
GOLFFRR
GOLFFRR's Avatar
10711
Rep
27,529
Posts

Drives: GOLFFRR cart
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: we sell BMWs to "ALL" US states

iTrader: (4)

Quote:
Originally Posted by F20MAW73 View Post
Why some reviews are stating it is already better than the M2?
I personally don't agree with that. the M2 is amazing and the comp is even better. Spent hours in one at a few BMW M schools would find it very hard to think this car would be better but tech is newer and more advanced Im sure so I have no doubt its close IMO
__________________

BEFORE YOU BUY YOUR NEXT BMW, EMAIL OUR GUY KOTE FIRST!
Kote M Sales:Kotem@bmwofcamarillo.com Cell:805-368-9101
vipfinance@bmwofcamarillo.com for warranties!
Appreciate 1
stein_325i25051.00
      08-24-2019, 01:34 PM   #62
Falafel Combo
Banned
United_States
3767
Rep
6,673
Posts

Drives: X5 xDrive50i
Join Date: May 2011
Location: New England

iTrader: (3)

He has no idea what he’s talking about.
Appreciate 1
      08-24-2019, 02:40 PM   #63
///M TOWN
.
///M TOWN's Avatar
13117
Rep
8,300
Posts

Drives: M GmbH
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: North America

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2018 M2  [8.78]
If BMW makes a proper Z4M, they will absolutely sell a shit ton of them.
__________________
///
Appreciate 0
      08-24-2019, 02:43 PM   #64
///M TOWN
.
///M TOWN's Avatar
13117
Rep
8,300
Posts

Drives: M GmbH
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: North America

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2018 M2  [8.78]
Quote:
Originally Posted by GOLFFRR View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by F20MAW73 View Post
Why some reviews are stating it is already better than the M2?
I personally don't agree with that. the M2 is amazing and the comp is even better. Spent hours in one at a few BMW M schools would find it very hard to think this car would be better but tech is newer and more advanced Im sure so I have no doubt its close IMO
I think they just like what BMW pulled off creating such stunning handling dynamics. I've yet to give my hooligan side seat time in the new Z4, but I'm going to drive one shortly to see for myself just how good it really is.
__________________
///
Appreciate 3
F20MAW73874.50
SakhirM410783.00
GOLFFRR10710.50
      08-24-2019, 03:04 PM   #65
themightyshrek
Enlisted Member
themightyshrek's Avatar
Japan
32
Rep
49
Posts

Drives: 2018 BMW M3 CS
Join Date: Jan 2019
Location: Germany

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by F20MAW73 View Post
Interesting he found it a better drivers car than the M2C. Not sure how true this is but I will take that.
Pretty respectabile german car magazine said that while testing and lapping the Nurburgring, the Z4 M40i had better mechanical grip than M2C, quoting higher speeds and stability through some turns.
Appreciate 2
SakhirM410783.00
      08-24-2019, 06:04 PM   #66
Advevo
Banned
576
Rep
1,170
Posts

Drives: M2 Competition, E30 M3 DTM
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Country where the taxes are too high!!

iTrader: (0)

Of course it s a better drivers car then an m2c

Because it is the right size for a drivers car.

Every new series from bmw gets bigger and heavier.

Make an m2 with s58 engine and the wheelbase of the z4 and get more weight out and there is youre drivers car.

No Bmw makes wheelbase longer car get bigger and heavier and compensates it with more hp. Totally wrong for a drivers car!
Appreciate 2
///M TOWN13117.00
wknddrivr463.00
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Tags
g29, reviews, savagegeese, z4 s30i

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:49 AM.




bmw
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST