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      07-25-2017, 10:33 AM   #221
pz619
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Also if you need further proof that this electric thing is happening, here you go:

http://www.2addicts.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1406434

"By 2025, the BMW Group expects electrified vehicles to account for between 15-25% of sales."
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      07-25-2017, 05:05 PM   #222
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We will see.
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      07-25-2017, 09:35 PM   #223
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Obioban View Post
I had read that it was now at 500,000, but even at 400,000 it pretty well invalidates your statement of "they need a market to sell to. There isn't one in the US which is 90% of planned sales".

I don't know any Tesla owners who considered the price of gas in their purchase. 100% of them bought it because it was a better car/ownership experience. I could see that changing as the cars get cheaper (more cost sensitive ownership base), but I think your way to wrapped up in the price of gas. Silent running, not having to fill up, massive torque, and simplicity of design are all very compelling features, and Tesla is years ahead of everyone else on autopilot (and gaining fast with the rate their taking data in compared to anyone else on the market).
How does this invalidate it? They need to sell 500k series 3 cars a yr to make it work. After 2 years the kool aid drinkers overbought only 400k, and probably half won't wait. They won't report the high number of refunds. 2 years and they couldn't even hit one years sales goal
They also said even this 400k will take years to fulfill because the factory isn't up to par yet. More years of loosing money. You can only ride stock hype and speculation so long before you need to meet your promises. We will see.

Last edited by Fundguy1; 07-25-2017 at 09:48 PM..
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      08-02-2017, 05:23 PM   #224
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Tesla sets yet another cash burning record. Now burning through greenbacks to the tune of $13 million per day.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-0...bout-get-worse
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      08-02-2017, 07:07 PM   #225
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NickyC View Post
Tesla sets yet another cash burning record. Now burning through greenbacks to the tune of $13 million per day.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-0...bout-get-worse
Great report without the bs.
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      08-03-2017, 10:18 AM   #226
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Future is EV vehicles. I work in the transportation industry and regulators are pushing for full EV (for light duty vehicles) very hard.
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      08-03-2017, 10:21 AM   #227
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NickyC View Post
Tesla sets yet another cash burning record. Now burning through greenbacks to the tune of $13 million per day.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-0...bout-get-worse
Wait... you're saying ramping up production for a mass produced car for the first time costs money...?

confusing.
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      08-03-2017, 10:23 AM   #228
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NickyC View Post
Tesla sets yet another cash burning record. Now burning through greenbacks to the tune of $13 million per day.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-0...bout-get-worse
The production of the Model 3s will make or break the company.
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      08-03-2017, 12:55 PM   #229
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SpeedChamp View Post
Tesla will always be a battery manufacturer as a backup if the cars don't run as they hope.
This is the end game.

EV is the future, but the future won't be here anytime soon since the infrastructure doesn't exist. These cars won't be taking over anything until everyone can charge their vehicles in a cost and time efficient manner. We still have decades to see this coming to fruition.

The Tesla cars are just a marketing exercise to get people excited about the prospect about owning/living with an EV. It's the battery manufacturing and the charging stations that Musk wants to own that will gain him the most power. That is why he opened up those patents. He WANTS other manufacturers to use his tech. He wants to be THE supplier for batteries and the infrastructure to power everything. Not just cars, but everybody's homes as well.
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      08-04-2017, 05:41 AM   #230
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Good chance they will.

And lets see what happens when EV lovers have to pay more for their cars when tax revenue from ice and oil dries up.


But but but my electricity bill keeps doubling every year, most of it being the new tax.
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      08-07-2017, 10:13 AM   #231
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Interesting articles.

http://thehill.com/blogs/pundits-blo...upport-already

http://dailysignal.com/2016/11/13/it...-and-cronyism/

Last edited by NickyC; 08-07-2017 at 10:21 AM..
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      08-09-2017, 12:54 AM   #232
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It's interesting how hybrid technology has become mainstream and not just mainstream, but "the preferred method" for absolute performance, as the ability to recapture some of the energy used in braking and using it to rocket out of the turn is simple a game-changer. People in this thread are still bringing up all kinds of crazy objections and obfuscations to the superiority of this technology, which is shared in hybrid vehicles. To be sure, this will continue to evolve and get better and better hybrids are definitely more realistic in the short term. The amount of HP to move a car at 70mph is very little, so having all that extra potential in the terms of heavy iron and cylinders makes no sense when it uses extra fuel, so hybrid technology will continue to evolve and become more mainstream, and that technology employs enough EV technology that it will also push EVs along, eventually bettering hybrid technology when infrastructure better supports it and battery density is even better. EVs are here right now and pratical, but not for everyone, but hybrids will continue to evolve and keep pushing EV technology closer to mainstream. It's funny to see all the people scared of EVs when hybrid sports cars have taken the segment to an entirely new level.
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      08-09-2017, 03:51 AM   #233
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      08-09-2017, 04:24 AM   #234
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chmura View Post
Future is EV vehicles. I work in the transportation industry and regulators are pushing for full EV (for light duty vehicles) very hard.
And i worked in construction and last thing anyone there wants is to be forced into using some mediocre gov forced on them EV pickup that takes half an hour to charge and loses towing capability as its battery drains.

Yes regulators are pushing it, not the out comes of a competitive free market place. unfortunately.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesNoBrakes View Post
It's interesting how hybrid technology has become mainstream and not just mainstream, but "the preferred method" for absolute performance, as the ability to recapture some of the energy used in braking and using it to rocket out of the turn is simple a game-changer. People in this thread are still bringing up all kinds of crazy objections and obfuscations to the superiority of this technology, which is shared in hybrid vehicles. To be sure, this will continue to evolve and get better and better hybrids are definitely more realistic in the short term. The amount of HP to move a car at 70mph is very little, so having all that extra potential in the terms of heavy iron and cylinders makes no sense when it uses extra fuel, so hybrid technology will continue to evolve and become more mainstream, and that technology employs enough EV technology that it will also push EVs along, eventually bettering hybrid technology when infrastructure better supports it and battery density is even better. EVs are here right now and pratical, but not for everyone, but hybrids will continue to evolve and keep pushing EV technology closer to mainstream. It's funny to see all the people scared of EVs when hybrid sports cars have taken the segment to an entirely new level.
Ohh so not true bud, if not for fascist government mandated fuel economy and emissions standards. Ice only would still be annihilating any of those performance hybrids.

Hell my twenty year old Toyota can spank most new sports car cars including many a "supercars".

Last edited by MSups6; 08-09-2017 at 04:32 AM..
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      08-09-2017, 10:01 AM   #235
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There is a whole lotta stupid in this thread.
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      08-09-2017, 02:15 PM   #236
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dthltm View Post
There is a whole lotta stupid in this thread.
Welcome
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      08-09-2017, 03:02 PM   #237
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You know the rebates for alternative fuel cars such as Tesla is limited to a certain amount of cars? The credit begins to phase out once a manufacturer has sold 200,000 vehicles, of any model. Edmunds estimates Tesla has sold about 121,000 cars since the rebate took effect in 2010. The govt subsidizes are pretty much almost gone for Tesla. It will help jump start sales of Model 3 but those will go away very quickly.

I like my gas powered sports cars but I definitely think electric is the future. Batteries are getting better (slowly) and charging technology as well.

Would I want my "fun" car to be electric? Probably not. I want the drama and to use both hands and feet to shift a manual transmission. But for my daily driving needs, electric car sounds perfect.
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      08-09-2017, 03:27 PM   #238
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urrrrrrghhh but "better" is still miles off what is needed re. charging.

No idea why people cannot see this.
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      08-09-2017, 03:45 PM   #239
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfisti View Post
urrrrrrghhh but "better" is still miles off what is needed re. charging.

No idea why people cannot see this.
Yes, but advancements are getting much better. We will see batteries with 3 times the capacity as lithium ion can today. That with quick charging technologies that can charge a car in 5 minutes... it's coming soon.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/forbest.../#7a7c5d8c9153
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      08-09-2017, 06:37 PM   #240
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfisti View Post
urrrrrrghhh but "better" is still miles off what is needed re. charging.

No idea why people cannot see this.
Because, for the current market charging is a _perceived_ issue, not an _actual_ issue for owners.

If it were an _actual_ issue, there would be a very simple solution.

Samsung: Wall Huggers

Here's what refueling would look like in an EV world:

Better Place battery Swap
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      08-10-2017, 08:50 AM   #241
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Z K View Post
Yes, but advancements are getting much better. We will see batteries with 3 times the capacity as lithium ion can today. That with quick charging technologies that can charge a car in 5 minutes... it's coming soon.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/forbest.../#7a7c5d8c9153
There's no evidence at all of it coming soon, range and charging has barely improved in the last ten years and further improvements will just get more difficult.

people are way, way too over-optimistic on this topic. I cannot wrap my head around it.
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      08-10-2017, 08:54 AM   #242
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xQx View Post
Because, for the current market charging is a _perceived_ issue, not an _actual_ issue for owners.
You cannot be serious, it's CLEARLY a real issue. For day to day use yeah you're fine but it restricts your ability to drive a lot in one day or be spontaneous.

Cannot believe what i am reading here.
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