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      04-21-2015, 01:50 PM   #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bkM3 View Post
no they weren't always like that, but they are now.

lets say they are a long way of (which i dont think they are), would you want to make it easier for them to get it? if somebody is openly stating that they want to murder you and your family are you going to give them the gun?
What is this based on? And since when does "Nuclear weapon" = Long range Capability?

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Originally Posted by Acertx View Post
So when we were in Iraq taking out Iran's former enemy, Iran according to you was cool with it since they didn't like Saddam either? What part of Iran helped kill American Soldiers in Iraq do you not understand? They want you dead because you are American. Cold hard truth, but it is the truth.
That isn't true. People don't hate America because of our freedoms, they hate us for our oppressive foreign policy.
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      04-21-2015, 02:06 PM   #68
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Originally Posted by TheAxiom View Post
That isn't true. People don't hate America because of our freedoms, they hate us for our oppressive foreign policy.
No it is true. If you think they stone homosexuals, stone woman who are raped, and treat woman as slaves because they don't believe in those things you refuse to see reason. Western cultures are diametrically opposed to those values, which means they hate you for what you believe. I'm not arguing every citizen feels that way, but the fact is their government sure does. Their government isn't being overthrown, because most of their people feel the same way.

So go ahead and travel to Iran, and visit the non tourist places. Or you know don't, so you don't get kidnapped and beheaded. The world is a cruel place outside of our borders cupcake, so do remember that before trashing one of our loyal allies that doesn't have thousands of miles of oceans separating them from our mutual enemies.
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      04-21-2015, 02:36 PM   #69
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Originally Posted by Acertx View Post
No it is true. If you think they stone homosexuals, stone woman who are raped, and treat woman as slaves because they don't believe in those things you refuse to see reason. Western cultures are diametrically opposed to those values, which means they hate you for what you believe. I'm not arguing every citizen feels that way, but the fact is their government sure does. Their government isn't being overthrown, because most of their people feel the same way.

So go ahead and travel to Iran, and visit the non tourist places. Or you know don't, so you don't get kidnapped and beheaded. The world is a cruel place outside of our borders cupcake, so do remember that before trashing one of our loyal allies that doesn't have thousands of miles of oceans separating them from our mutual enemies.
But WHY do I care? We apparently aren't so different from Iran [in] that we deny basic rights to our own citizens on the basis of sexual preference and target/incarcerate segments of our populations for being of a different ethinc/racial backround.

Israel isn't too innocent on that front either, giving 'manditory birth control' to brown people (becuase they are brown) http://www.forbes.com/sites/eliseknu...birth-control/

Israel is engaged in a lot of shady dealings too, like actually spying on the US
http://www.wsj.com/articles/israel-s...lks-1427164201
(and I believe the claim that the Israel stole information and materials of WMDS from the US)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_weapons_and_Israel

I have no desire to go anywhere near Israel OR Iran, but I'm not going to pretend there is a good guy in this situation. Israel has the money and the man power, let them defend themselves.

Last edited by Taskmaster; 04-21-2015 at 03:58 PM..
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      04-21-2015, 02:48 PM   #70
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You are delusional if you think that life in Iran is anything close to life here in the United States. The only country in that whole region remotely as civilized as our country is Israel. None of this changes the fact that arguing for Iran to have nuclear weapons is illogical and dangerous thinking.

I will say it once more... Iran directly contributed to the deaths of American Soldiers in Iraq.
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      04-21-2015, 03:57 PM   #71
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Originally Posted by Acertx View Post
You are delusional if you think that life in Iran is anything close to life here in the United States.
When did I EVER say this?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Acertx View Post
The only country in that whole region remotely as civilized as our country is Israel. None of this changes the fact that arguing for Iran to have nuclear weapons is illogical and dangerous thinking.

I will say it once more... Iran directly contributed to the deaths of American Soldiers in Iraq.
You do know Israel has killed American soliders too...and tried to cover it up.
I don't care about Israel or Iran, I hope they find a peaceful resolution and stop dragging the US into the middle of it.
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      04-21-2015, 04:51 PM   #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheAxiom View Post
What is this based on? And since when does "Nuclear weapon" = Long range Capability?



That isn't true. People don't hate America because of our freedoms, they hate us for our oppressive foreign policy.

long range capabilities isnt such a big deal when you consider the fact that a small nuclear warhead can fit in a suitcase. or the fact that isis is basically knocking on their door. what would happen if they got their hands on a nuclear weapon?
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      04-21-2015, 05:02 PM   #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheAxiom View Post
When did I EVER say this?



You do know Israel has killed American soliders too...and tried to cover it up.
I don't care about Israel or Iran, I hope they find a peaceful resolution and stop dragging the US into the middle of it.
red- if you are referring to the USS Liberty incident, every single investigation has concluded that it was an accident. how can you use this as an argument to let iran have nukes? a government that is hell bent on killing you?

blue- agreed, problem is how do you have peace with somebody who wants to kill you for simply being you?
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      04-21-2015, 05:18 PM   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bkM3 View Post
long range capabilities isnt such a big deal when you consider the fact that a small nuclear warhead can fit in a suitcase. or the fact that isis is basically knocking on their door. what would happen if they got their hands on a nuclear weapon?
Quote:
Originally Posted by bkM3 View Post
red- if you are referring to the USS Liberty incident, every single investigation has concluded that it was an accident. how can you use this as an argument to let iran have nukes? a government that is hell bent on killing you?

blue- agreed, problem is how do you have peace with somebody who wants to kill you for simply being you?
But that's not the case - I didn't say (or allude to) that Iran 'deserves' nukes because American died at the hands of Isralis.

There is no evidence that shows Iran is anywhere near obtaining the capability of creating a warhead, nor do I think it's OUR job to police them. The UN, fine, but the US playing Israel's lap dog - no.

Last edited by Taskmaster; 04-22-2015 at 08:33 AM..
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      04-22-2015, 08:30 AM   #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheAxiom View Post
What is this based on? And since when does "Nuclear weapon" = Long range Capability?
You don't do much reading on Iran's military and and the Republican guard, do you??

Nuclear weapons don't = long range capability.

Inter-Continental Ballistic Missiles (ICBM's) = long range capability.

It is widely known that Iran has missiles with at least a 2,000km range:

http://www.washingtoninstitute.org/u...22_Nadimi4.pdf

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armed_F...listic_program

http://www.janes.com/article/42880/p...istic-missiles
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      04-22-2015, 08:33 AM   #76
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Originally Posted by TheAxiom View Post
But that's not the case - I didn't say (or allude to) that Iran 'deserves' nukes becuase American's died at the hands of Isralis.

There is no evidence that shows Iran is anywhere near obtaining the capability of creating a warhead, nor do I think it's OUR job to police them. The UN, fine, but the US playing Israel's lap dog - no.
Why are there so many people in here bringing up Israel and its supposed evilness? I thought we were talking about Iran's nuclear ambitions??

And when was the last time the UN did anything (in terms of enforcement or military action) by itself, without the backing of the US?

The UN is a mediocre humanitarian organization, and a horrendously inept peacekeeping organization.
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      04-22-2015, 08:39 AM   #77
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Originally Posted by Dalko43 View Post
Why are there so many people in here bringing up Israel and its supposed evilness? I thought we were talking about Iran's nuclear ambitions??

And when was the last time the UN did anything (in terms of enforcement or military action) by itself, without the backing of the US?

The UN is a mediocre humanitarian organization, and a horrendously inept peacekeeping organization.
So is the US. Again, I don't think it's our job to be defenders of Israel, and while you may think the UN as ineffective, I think th current deal that Obama negotiated is a step in the right direction. Lol @ 'supposed evilness'. You don't think forcing BC on people to stop them from reproducing is wrong? No side is right here, it's a matter of perspective.
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      04-22-2015, 08:41 AM   #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dalko43 View Post
You don't do much reading on Iran's military and and the Republican guard, do you??

Nuclear weapons don't = long range capability.

Inter-Continental Ballistic Missiles (ICBM's) = long range capability.

It is widely known that Iran has missiles with at least a 2,000km range:

http://www.washingtoninstitute.org/u...22_Nadimi4.pdf

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armed_F...listic_program

http://www.janes.com/article/42880/p...istic-missiles
None of thos pose any danger directly to the US.
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      04-22-2015, 09:04 AM   #79
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Originally Posted by TheAxiom View Post
None of thos pose any danger directly to the US.
Are we including US shipping, aircraft, tourists, and US military personnel located in that geographic region?

And are we fine with our countries (Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Israel, Egypt, Pakistan) potentially getting nuked and provoked into a response?

The whole taboo of nuclear war/brinkmanship is that it can quickly cascade into a global conflict, which isn't in anybody's best interests.
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      04-22-2015, 10:08 AM   #80
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Originally Posted by Dalko43 View Post
Are we including US shipping, aircraft, tourists, and US military personnel located in that geographic region?

And are we fine with our countries (Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Israel, Egypt, Pakistan) potentially getting nuked and provoked into a response?

The whole taboo of nuclear war/brinkmanship is that it can quickly cascade into a global conflict, which isn't in anybody's best interests.
Israel (maybe) and Pakistan both have a nuclear arsenal already, and there are already many assumptions here, including:

If Iran has Nuclear weapons (they don't)
If they are close the developing one (they aren't)
Their long range weapons pose a threat to the US (they don't)
If they had weapons, they would actively attempt to use them...(Like NK...right)
That it's our job to provide stability to the region (not really)
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      04-25-2015, 03:12 AM   #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheAxiom View Post
When did I EVER say this?
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheAxiom View Post
We apparently aren't so different from Iran [in] that we deny basic rights to our own citizens on the basis of sexual preference and target/incarcerate segments of our populations for being of a different ethinc/racial backround.

Right here. If you had anything besides delusions about how life really is in the Middle East you would understand that here in the USA we don't throw people off of buildings or stone them because of their sexual orientation, unlike many Middle Eastern countries!
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      04-25-2015, 07:42 PM   #82
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Right here. If you had anything besides delusions about how life really is in the Middle East you would understand that here in the USA we don't throw people off of buildings or stone them because of their sexual orientation, unlike many Middle Eastern countries!
But are we that much better than them? We still openly discrimate on citizens of our country, and have the highest population in the world. Yeah, we really don't have the moral authority to talk down other countries. Just saying.
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      04-25-2015, 08:39 PM   #83
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But are we that much better than them? We still openly discrimate on citizens of our country, and have the highest population in the world. Yeah, we really don't have the moral authority to talk down other countries. Just saying.
Yes, yes we really are that much better than them. Nice how you completely ignore the fact that they actually kill citizens because they're gay, are victims of rape, or not Muslim. I guess killing people by stoning and throwing them off buildings is the exact same thing as individual citizens not liking homosexuals. How about you actually learn about what really goes on in their culture before you try to play your moral equivalence game.

Also Iran by supplying training, material, and personnel support to our enemies in Iraq was an act of war. Should we also ignore the fact that they are a state sponsor of terrorism?

Also did you really say that we are the largest country in the world by population? Geez have you ever even left the USA, or at least picked up a book that wasn't propaganda?
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      04-25-2015, 09:10 PM   #84
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Originally Posted by Acertx View Post
Yes, yes we really are that much better than them. Nice how you completely ignore the fact that they actually kill citizens because they're gay, are victims of rape, or not Muslim. I guess killing people by stoning and throwing them off buildings is the exact same thing as individual citizens not liking homosexuals. How about you actually learn about what really goes on in their culture before you try to play your moral equivalence game.

Also Iran by supplying training, material, and personnel support to our enemies in Iraq was an act of war. Should we also ignore the fact that they are a state sponsor of terrorism?

Also did you really say that we are the largest country in the world by population? Geez have you ever even left the USA, or at least picked up a book that wasn't propaganda?
Largest prison population*
Proof?
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      04-25-2015, 09:33 PM   #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheAxiom View Post
But are we that much better than them? We still openly discrimate on citizens of our country, and have the highest population in the world. Yeah, we really don't have the moral authority to talk down other countries. Just saying.
WOW, the ignorance in the second sentence is mind boggling. Where do you live that you see we, as a society to quote, "openly discriminate on citizens of our country". Thank you US public school system... But let's just throw even more money at the problem instead of fixing it. We spend nearly 15k per student to turn out morons. Yet countries that spend less then 10% are kicking our asses in Math, Science, Reading/Comprehension, ect... Typical Lib mentality, well we need more money to fix the problem, let's raise taxes. So let's see, since the Federal Dept. Of Education was founded we have have not seen any results that show the correlation of more money = smarter students. Actual what you can see is the exact opposite. Every year we keep spending more money and our students are slipping further down the line in relation to world standings, embarrassing... Send them to a charter schools or private schools for half of that and you'll get better results and save half.

What you fail to see that "we" are the exception to the rule in the world when it comes to blatant discrimination. No one, nor no place is perfect. Are there racists, bigots, homophobes in the U.S.? Of course there are but is that the rule or a very small exception? If you were even remotely objective the answer to that question is obvious. Just in case you don't get it we are the exception. I would rather live in a place where it's the exception and not the rule. Where as the "they" are the rule. It is the exact opposite and the mere fact you can't see something as obvious as the nose on your face speaks volumes.

Just like all this white cops are hunting down innocent black men like dogs in the streets according to some members of Congress and clowns like Sharpton. I'm ashamed that these people are actually representatives of this country and have a bully pit to spew this nonsense from. So now all cops are racists, monsters who wake up every morning looking for for a righteous kill. In 2012 the number of blacks who were killed by officers was roughly 125. The number of white man who were killed in a police confrontation was nearly 400. Looking at those numbers shows that many more white man are killed in police interactions then black men are.

But wait, whites make up roughly 70% of the population and blacks only about 17%. So now looking at those numbers it appears to be a little more skewed when looking at the population percentages. But when faced with the fact that while blacks only make up 17% of the population they make up more then 50% of all murders in the U.S. Let's not talk about other crimes which is more then 70%. Out of the 125 or so that were killed in police interactions how many do you honestly think we're just good, church going, choir boys? I don't deny that even one is to many, black or white and that there are some bad cops but once again those are the exception NOT rule.

But if you watched the main stream media every day they would have you believing that nearly every day some innocent black man is being hunted down and killed in the streets. It's just not true just like the whole Hands Up Don't Shoot mantra was based on a lie, 3 separate investigations proved that to be a lie, one of those investigations was Eric Holders Justice Dept. so don't you tell me that it was fixed. Look at what happened to Ferguson and hell, the rest of the country when people rush to judgement and create false narratives to push an agenda rather then report on actual facts.

Did anyone of those asssholes in the NFL, NBA, Congress, Hollywood, Rappers/Musicians apologize for perpetuating a lie/myth? Of course not because it doesn't fit the narrative. It's easier to play the victim and make excuses for the action of the animals who destroyed a community and started all those marches for justice for a criminal who in the end got what he deserved. He strong armed a shop keeper trying to make a living for some stupid cigars, then struck a cop, tried to wrestle his gun, fights him in the truck and then comes back for more resulting in the officer taking action which led to the loss of his life. He had more then one chance and choice but choose wrong each time... I'm tired, goodnight
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      04-25-2015, 10:20 PM   #86
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That tirade had nothing to do with what I posted nor did it disprove it.
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      04-26-2015, 03:52 AM   #87
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Originally Posted by TheAxiom View Post
Largest prison population*
Proof?
People commit crimes, and then we throw them in jail. This is proof that we discriminate because??? Once again how about you travel to the Middle East then tell me about how awful the US is?
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      04-26-2015, 09:21 AM   #88
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People commit crimes, and then we throw them in jail. This is proof that we discriminate because??? Once again how about you travel to the Middle East then tell me about how awful the US is?
Listen strawmam, when you fail to acknowledge the problems we have hear in the US, you look less credible, like a prison system that is for profit, and is literally a revolving door that does nothing to rehabilitate thise who are in it. We have people who are still treated as second class citizens (women/minorites/gays), we pretty much support our own brand of terrorism, where we bomb people with drones and care little for the innocent who lose thier life in the process - we a shit ton of other issues we should work on fixing before pointing fingers at another country/people.
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