08-13-2020, 10:52 AM | #89 | |
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Also, the N'Ring did get faster in the last year or so since they repaved some of the track, so realistically whichever way you want to skin it, if comparing before and after, the older cars would either be a couple seconds faster, or the new cars a couple second slower to account for that to make it more apples to apple there. |
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08-13-2020, 10:56 AM | #90 |
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The posted time is laughable, what's so special about 7:42??
The new Porsche Panamera Turbo, a 4-door sedan, posted 7:29:81! FFS, BMW, is this the best you can do?? |
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08-13-2020, 01:19 PM | #91 |
Luxury at the redline :)
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It's sounds about right for this segment of vehicles:
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08-13-2020, 01:25 PM | #92 |
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08-13-2020, 01:45 PM | #93 |
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08-13-2020, 03:25 PM | #94 |
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Yes they have and achieved a 7:42 with an M4cs, which about on par with the M2cs. They noted that the M4cs was tested on a rather hot day which hampered its lap time and the 'ring has also since been significantly re-paved (many bumps removed) which made it a few seconds faster. So it is not a direct comparision. I however expect the M4cs and M2cs to be fairly close in terms of performance.
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08-13-2020, 04:05 PM | #95 | ||
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M2C 1,630kg M4cs 1,609kg M2cs 1,588kg
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08-13-2020, 04:15 PM | #96 |
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Cracks me up when people compare faster heavier cars to lighter slower cars. If you like quick highway pulls that's fine, if you like a nimble car that's fine too. Heavy cars around town at regular speeds are dull. I bet the M5 is great on the hwy though. A comfy rocket.
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08-13-2020, 04:52 PM | #97 | |
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Hard to make a blanket statement about what is heavy vs what is not, but to me, a light car by current day standards would need to be below 3300 lbs. |
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08-13-2020, 07:04 PM | #98 | |
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2023 CB X5 45e 2018 i3 94 2014 Cayman S Last edited by sdhotwn; 08-13-2020 at 07:10 PM.. |
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08-14-2020, 12:42 AM | #99 |
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There is at minimum a $75,000 difference in price between the two cars... I'm pretty sure that is something that needs to be taken into account.
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08-14-2020, 03:46 AM | #100 |
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The class record holders...
https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/a...nitive-rundown And 'the list' for those interested. (CS lap not added yet)... https://fastestlaps.com/tracks/nordschleife
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08-14-2020, 06:56 AM | #102 |
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Yes, it's funny because lots of chatter about it needing to be 100lbs lighter. It's costly but 42kg is 92.5 lbs. Throw in a lightweight battery to bring it to 130lb reduction.
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08-14-2020, 07:38 AM | #103 | |
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The e36/e46 were never very light cars, and the e92 and f8x have hit the scales in some specs close to 3700 lbs. The M2 certainly is quite heavy despite a relatively small footprint at 3500-36XX lbs depending on spec - again, a good amount of that weight is likely new safety, wider wheels/tires. Yea the Miata isnt quite as light as it once was. Even the Alfa 4C is about 2300-2400 in the US while in the EU is under 2K lbs. |
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08-14-2020, 11:02 AM | #104 | |
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The US-spec E36 M3 was listed at 3219lbs with a 5sp manual. 300lbs over 20+ years isn't a huge amount if you look at it from one perspective. I think the Boxster/Caymans gained a similar amount in the intervening time (200-300lbs). Still, 3,500lbs with 450BHP is heavy on track.
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08-14-2020, 02:00 PM | #105 | |||||
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Quote:
Reposting a comment from the past: Quote:
For a good example, see here: Quote:
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08-14-2020, 02:05 PM | #106 | |
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08-14-2020, 02:23 PM | #107 | |
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My miata was fun "go kart" feeling. Was it more to do with the size or was it the weight. Both? It felt like it was on rails. Arguably if you add enough grip to a heavy car it will take corners quickly as well. My f-type feels very large and not nimble, but if I toss it into a corner it holds. It's just not very confidence inspiring. Would a 3500lb miata still be fun due to it's size? Is weight not the issue but the distribution of weight, and center of mass? Would a small 4000lb car with a low center of mass and well distributed weight feel nimble/fun/small? Think small heavy electric car. |
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08-14-2020, 02:34 PM | #108 | |
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The most fun out those - Miata Cup, 570S, Huracan, and Skippy Formula. The 570 and Huracan never felt heavy and the turn in for both was amazing and confidence inspiring. So I think it is all relative, and I don't think weight is really the be all end all, but it is MUCH easier to make a lighter car feel more fun and have more approachable limits - especially at affordable prices. I never felt like a better driver, or more confident in what I was doing than in that Miata though. So size or something certainly matters.
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2023 CB X5 45e 2018 i3 94 2014 Cayman S Last edited by sdhotwn; 08-14-2020 at 02:43 PM.. |
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08-14-2020, 02:54 PM | #109 | |
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08-14-2020, 03:38 PM | #110 |
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And providing road and wind noise. But i loved it!
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2023 CB X5 45e 2018 i3 94 2014 Cayman S Last edited by sdhotwn; 08-14-2020 at 04:09 PM.. |
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