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      05-31-2020, 09:19 PM   #1
floridaorange
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Yes we must actively fight racism that exists. I think where a lot of us get triggered is when an incident occurs like George Floyd's and most of us have been not just imagining a better society but trying to live and create one, these incidents feel like we are all collectively being dragged back to a time that we no longer want to exist in. And it's messy and it feels unfair for everyone.


Start watching @ 3 mins 30 seconds





Racism creates race, not the other way around," Williams told Maher. "So I think that you have to be able to do two things. We have to fight the racism that exists in the society that we have and you have to keep an eye on imagining a better society that we want to have."

"I don't think you can get a better future that you can't first imagine," Willaims said.

"So I don't think it's enough to be anti-racist, but I think that you also need to be anti-race. If this is not a biological reality...I don't think Neil would agree that it's a biological reality, right?" he asked the astrophysicist.

"What I can tell is that when I am asked what race I am, I say 'I am the human race,'" deGrasse Tyson said to thunderous applause.
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      05-31-2020, 09:29 PM   #2
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labels , labels and more labels
everyone's got a label
we need to stop focusing on what makes us different, and more on what makes us the same
I honestly don't see race, we're all just people
you treat me with respect and respect will be given, 2 way street
I could care less what your skin tone is
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      05-31-2020, 09:35 PM   #3
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...and don't forget good ol identity politics!

Can also go to hell.


Historian Arthur Schlesinger Jr. discussed identity politics extensively in his 1991 book The Disuniting of America. Schlesinger, a strong supporter of liberal conceptions of civil rights, argues that a liberal democracy requires a common basis for culture and society to function. Rather than seeing civil society as already fractured along lines of power and powerlessness (according to race, ethnicity, sexuality, etc), Schlesinger suggests that basing politics on group marginalization is itself what fractures the civil polity, and that identity politics therefore works against creating real opportunities for ending marginalization. Schlesinger believes that:

movements for civil rights should aim toward full acceptance and integration of marginalized groups into the mainstream culture, rather than … perpetuating that marginalization through affirmations of difference
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      05-31-2020, 09:41 PM   #4
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I tried explaining the situation to my 9 year old daughter today. When I told her the victim was black, she asked me "what does that mean"? It's not that she doesn't have any black friends, she just never knew that there was a label, which shows she never thought race mattered.

It made me sad to think that I just probably changed how she views race forever.

Last edited by dsad1; 05-31-2020 at 10:29 PM..
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      05-31-2020, 09:43 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by floridaorange View Post
...and don't forget good ol identity politics!

Can also go to hell.


Historian Arthur Schlesinger Jr. discussed identity politics extensively in his 1991 book The Disuniting of America. Schlesinger, a strong supporter of liberal conceptions of civil rights, argues that a liberal democracy requires a common basis for culture and society to function. Rather than seeing civil society as already fractured along lines of power and powerlessness (according to race, ethnicity, sexuality, etc), Schlesinger suggests that basing politics on group marginalization is itself what fractures the civil polity, and that identity politics therefore works against creating real opportunities for ending marginalization. Schlesinger believes that:

movements for civil rights should aim toward full acceptance and integration of marginalized groups into the mainstream culture, rather than perpetuating that marginalization through affirmations of difference
It started with the good ol' hyphenated American. Diversity. We used to be a melting pot or, as I thought, a refractory tower burning off the old and bad things from different cultures leaving only the best attributes of those cultures to strengthen the American culture.

They we got multi-culturalism, cultural relativity, and the dreaded Participation Trophy. Then came the PC movement which begat identity politics and boom: Welcome to The Fuq All States of America.

SMFH...

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      05-31-2020, 10:02 PM   #6
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I believe these two are very important.

Luke 6:31 - Do to others as you would have them do to you.
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      05-31-2020, 10:09 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pikkagtr View Post
labels , labels and more labels
everyone's got a label
we need to stop focusing on what makes us different, and more on what makes us the same
I honestly don't see race, we're all just people
you treat me with respect and respect will be given, 2 way street
I could care less what your skin tone is


This is spot on. Its the labels everyone uses that is fueling/building to this and it continues.

Example from a recent news story that was plastered all over, a black small business owner lost everything when his business was burnt down.

I dont care what color the business owner is, its tragic for anyone/everyone regardless of their race.
If Derek Chauvin was black, would this all still be going on?

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      05-31-2020, 10:31 PM   #8
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The only real division is public vs private/individual. Once people notice that it a battle of their private and individual rights being intruded upon by public entities (government, corperation, unions, banks, and so on) ans that all this race crap is just a diversion tactic to have us fight one another while the public stomps on our rights more.
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      05-31-2020, 10:33 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rwheels View Post
I believe these two are very important.

Luke 6:31 - Do to others as you would have them do to you.
I normaly reference Matt. 7:12
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      Yesterday, 07:42 AM   #10
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We're so far from moving past racism, that we can't even agree on the definition of what racism is. That's where I'm discouraged by the topic.
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      Yesterday, 08:00 AM   #11
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My Dad sometimes says - "the original human sin is "I'm better than you are" because of a. b. c. or 1. 2. 3. "

It's not fun to grapple with, especially in a hyper competitive environment like America.

It's ok to be discouraged by it, I am too.

I think at the end of the day, having MEANINGFUL conversations with your fellow American's who feel they are being discriminated against or treated unfairly due to the color of their skin, is where understanding begins. I've had some very good conversations about race with black American's. Sometimes ending in hugs and tears, yes both parties feel uncomfortable, but that's ok!

Keep in mind. To actually listen to someone, especially someone who is from a different culture, class, race or whatever, takes a lot of strength in your character. Because you run the risk of being changed, your paradigm being changed.

Many American's don't want their paradigm changed, they don't have time and they don't see the benefit.
The human experience is different for all of us, vastly different. There are always 2 sides to the story.

It's worth exploring, it's worth listening, it's worth being uncomfortable, it's worth not making perfect sense, it's worth feeling foolish or naive or whatever. The conversations still need to happen for their to be meaningful change.

Right will always be right, wrong will always be wrong.
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      Yesterday, 08:35 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NormanConquest View Post
The only real division is public vs private/individual. Once people notice that it a battle of their private and individual rights being intruded upon by public entities (government, corperation, unions, banks, and so on) ans that all this race crap is just a diversion tactic to have us fight one another while the public stomps on our rights more.
Can you elaborate further? I feel there is some truth to this but can't quite put my finger on what part.

Thanks!
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      Yesterday, 10:32 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MKSixer View Post
It started with the good ol' hyphenated American. Diversity. We used to be a melting pot or, as I thought, a refractory tower burning off the old and bad things from different cultures leaving only the best attributes of those cultures to strengthen the American culture.

They we got multi-culturalism, cultural relativity, and the dreaded Participation Trophy. Then came the PC movement which begat identity politics and boom: Welcome to The Fuq All States of America.

SMFH...

I have to look for it, but a few months ago, some scholar published a book in this very subject. The book discusses the equal rights act of 1964, which is where multi-culturalism, cultural relativity stem from. The author was interviewed on the morning drive time radio show on WMAL. Basically, the equal rights act has re-created tribalism, and made it legal.

My only question regarding the Floyd case is, is everyone just assuming the cop was a racist? Perhaps he was just a fucking dickhead authority-hungry cop, and Floyd's ethnicity really wasn't a factor in the cop's actions?
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      Yesterday, 11:28 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dsad1 View Post
I tried explaining the situation to my 9 year old daughter today. When I told her the victim was black, she asked me "what does that mean"? It's not that she doesn't have any black friends, she just never knew that there was a label, which shows she never thought race mattered.

It made me sad to think that I just probably changed how she views race forever.
Do NOT give up on her!!! In 10-15 years, she will be one of those on the street, hopefully you teach her the difference between protesting injustice, and stealing/lawlessness.

P.S. You didn't expect to learn from your 9yo, did you?
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      Yesterday, 08:26 PM   #15
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      Yesterday, 09:01 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by floridaorange View Post
He looks like an articulate Butler happy to be in high (color) company, telling them what they want to hear...
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      Yesterday, 09:02 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by floridaorange View Post
Can you elaborate further? I feel there is some truth to this but can't quite put my finger on what part.

Thanks!
Think about all the outrage over the last 100 years

Floyd was the Public (the government) using excess force over a petty small counterfeit bill which he may or may not know he had, intoxication (which is an individual failing), and resistance (which may have been driven do to pass experience with the police and being intoxicated.) none of those crimes justify the force the was exhibited.

The lockdown was the fault of a Socialist government (public wet dream) hiding and misinforming the world community, a global institution (also paid by and run by the public) going along with it. Our public institutions instead of just being upfront and honest with people and let individuals and private business do what is best for them they took it as a opportunity to dictate what best for everyone which resulted in destroy millions of peoples lives in a instant for something that has taken only 100,000 lives in 3+ months

Furthermore the global pandemic would have never occurred if we didn't have globalism which was driven by Public companies who lack any conscience or morality since it a collective of individuals who only care about profit over anything else and a large contributors of those investors are the government who invested the pension and 401k of government union workers (another public entity) since what they promise was never realistically possible and was only agree upon to get cheap and easy votes for securing power.

At what cost? At the individual private property owner rights, at the individual purchasing power, at the individual job security and well being. Yet we enter into another crisis and like all the major crisis since collapse of New York's Knickerbocker Trust Co people who are ignorant of this are going to forfeit more property rights, more purchasing power, more individual liberty and rights and give it to the same institutions that keep causing these crisis which are the Federal Government, The Banks, The Unions, and the Corporations.

Sorry if it a bit incoherent I would have to start pre federal reserve a book as long as war and peace to really get into the nitty gritty but just think about of the last dozen crisis they always come from a public institution and it always result in that same public institution or another gaining more power and us getting shit on in the long run.
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      Today, 06:15 AM   #18
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Thank you - that's a really interesting take - I think you are making some really strong points actually.

So the greater good of the general public was not the priority - the priority was the public institutions or publicly traded companies?
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